millikins
Well-Known Member
if the SNP are truly serious about another independence vote perhaps they should insist that it is open to the English voter too. I think they could be reasonably certain of the outcome then.
The SNP and Mrs Nicola Sturgeon
- Thread starter Judgemental
- Start date
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Need a like button for that!!!
Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
Snap! There is in fact a move to force Independence upon Scotland. Never mind 'We want to leave'. …….. Excellent, '…….. Go'!
Sturgeon has become something of a prima donna, and she needs to grasp the concept of negotiation.
Alec.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
Inspired .
But I don't think I have the strength ATM.
All this EU thing has me exhausted .
Buddy'sMum
Well-Known Member
Shutterbug
Well-Known Member
What specifically has she done that gives you the impression that she has no negotiation skills? And has become a Prima Donna??
Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
Her demands and bullish approach. Perhaps it's how the media reports her, and if that's the problem then there are other routes by which she can have the world understand her.
Alec.
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Mainly because for example all the people she tried to speak to in europe told her to go away and not to poke her nose into the situation as none of them have any intention of negotiating with her. I am sure that is not what she told her electorate in Scotland however. She thinks she has a mandate to do whatever she likes and has become carried away, remember europe warned her she was wasting her time going there but she thought they would give in. She always wants her cake and to eat it.
If we in England give you the freedom to create your own laws what gives scotland the right to interfer in laws that only effect England because whatever you think that is the situation we are in and she uses that for political point scoring and to show everybody she is using her disproportionate power.
Shutterbug
Well-Known Member
But they didn't. I have no idea where you get that from. She was there for talks and she talked. She has a mandate to keep Scotland in the EU. And it's nowt to do with how she reported it, it's what the EU member states and other governing bodies responded with rather publicly.
Westminster hasn't given Scotland the right to make all her own laws. I'll let you know when they do. She voted on one bloody thing, a repeal on hunting and she did so because the people who voted her in demanded she did. Seriously take the blinkers off mate. And read a news article now and again.
And wether you like it or not the SNP has as much right to vote on matters of public interest in this country as any other party. They were democratically voted in so I suggest you deal with it
Oh and by the way how does it feel to have a group of people not vote in by England get to say what happens In England?? Yeah....didn't bother a jot when it was England making all the decisions for Scotland - welcome to our world. How's the view?
Last edited:
Shutterbug
Well-Known Member
The world seems to understand her perfectly well and she is a very well respected politician like it or not. My brother lives in England as do many of my friends and they do tell me that the English newspapers portray her I a as slightly different light though. I'm not in England so can't say
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
When you say country which one you talking about England? or are you lumping us all together when it suits you to do so.
If its England you are indeed doing what you say you dont.
Im glad you have just clarified the sense of entitlement those in power in scotland seem to exhibited and the pathetic chip on the shoulder of the whingers north of the border like I say be very careful of where some of your politicians are trying to lead you as you may not like the outcome.
One day you may realise you are indeed being conned just to achieve the SNP s holy grail. It will be to late then.
Last edited:
Buddy'sMum
Well-Known Member
Really? Pretty sure she met with Guy Verhofstadt (one of the Brexit negotiators), Jean Claude Juncker and Martin Schulz.
And MSPs voted overwhelmingly in support of her commencing negotiations with the EU (92 to 0, I think). So she didn't think she had a mandate, she actually did have a mandate!
Shutterbug
Well-Known Member
In case you missed it there was this thing called a referendum and we are still part of the U.K. So we get to vote and we get a say. You know , Better Together, until it suits English politicians who suddenly decided that we were not really in it together and the prospect of having anyone from Scotland have the remotest say I the country they so desperately wanted us to remain part of was just too much for them. But like the English people who think Scotland should just sit down and shut up. It's not me with the chip Hun. And it's not a sense of entitlement, it's a democratically given right.
Last edited:
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
JCJ and MS( I heard both state very clearly on the radio) both told her they could not discuss membership ,there is a very big difference between meeting somebody and actually negotiating. By the way 92 meps voted out of 751 in total hardly a huge open arms welcome and not enough to actually count within the parliament where abstaining is the usual way of saying no.
Shutterbug
Well-Known Member
MSP's Members of Scottish Parliament. Of which there are 92, voted 100% on the talks and provided the mandate for those talks
Buddy'sMum
Well-Known Member
Eh? What are you talking about?
Judgemental
Well-Known Member
Very good point.
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Sorry my mistake. However I am sure you are well aware that national assemblies with such large majorities can be very unpredictable beast but hey you guys will have to live with it .
Still dont quite understand why the great desire to become part of europe when they will be trying to take away the freedoms bestowed on your country by devolution. Luckily I think europe will actually be forced to change and we will all stay in at the end of the day.
Buddy'sMum
Well-Known Member
Well isn't England going to be in that very position every single time the SNP MPs are excluded from from voting in Westminster?
Roasted Chestnuts
Well-Known Member
Pops it's ridiculously ill informed head above the parapet, writes a moronic post, looks about with a ridiculous self satisfied smirk. Yeah sit back down and face the corner as stupid trolls should.
Roasted Chestnuts
Well-Known Member
Have we not been a part of Europe through being part of the U.K. Since devolution?? Or am I missing something? Some new ruling that will take place should we join independent of England and Wales and Northern Ireland??? Haven't noticed theses losses of freedoms during these last years. Could you please quote this legislation?? I'd be rather interested
dibbin
Well-Known Member
Have we not been a part of Europe through being part of the U.K. Since devolution?? Or am I missing something? Some new ruling that will take place should we join independent of England and Wales and Northern Ireland??? Haven't noticed theses losses of freedoms during these last years. Could you please quote this legislation?? I'd be rather interested
Black Beastie ... you're not actually asking them to back up their rants with FACTS, are you? Perish the thought
Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
The UK is a part of Europe and that makes us Europeans, and short of widening the English Chanel by 500 miles, nothing will ever change that. The EU as an entity has grown and beyond the relatively small group of nations which decided to group together to enable unfettered trade and movement and with its expansion, it's become a massive, unwieldy and uncomfortable body. The EU has also become a luxury which we don't need and we can no longer afford.
I see and hope for a positive future. I truly believe that if the UK is as important to Europe as we're told, then in the future we can and will have a positive effect upon the EU. Perverse though it may sound, rather than the nonsense which is tripped out about us changing the system from within, which simply won't happen, we will, when released from the existing fetters, have a positive and reasoning influence. If that means that other nations view our progress and take a similar path, and if the EU oppression is neutered, then that will be all to the good.
We will never be anything but Europeans.
Alec.
I see and hope for a positive future. I truly believe that if the UK is as important to Europe as we're told, then in the future we can and will have a positive effect upon the EU. Perverse though it may sound, rather than the nonsense which is tripped out about us changing the system from within, which simply won't happen, we will, when released from the existing fetters, have a positive and reasoning influence. If that means that other nations view our progress and take a similar path, and if the EU oppression is neutered, then that will be all to the good.
We will never be anything but Europeans.
Alec.
Roasted Chestnuts
Well-Known Member
Black Beastie ... you're not actually asking them to back up their rants with FACTS, are you? Perish the thought
Oh?? Was the above Drivel then??? Was it more scaremongering? My bad for expecting truth then really from people obviously just reading the daily fail.
Alec that's an interesting statement.
Judgemental
Well-Known Member
The Prime Minster has been very clear with Mrs Sturgeon according to the BBC News, when they met for only 45 minutes at Bute House, this morning. The picture shows Mrs May and Mrs Sturgeon flanked by two Saltire flags.
If Mrs Sturgeon had an ounce of courtesy and good manners, she would have substituted one with the Union flag. Surprised she did not have the EU flag.
"From the BBC Prime Minister Theresa May has held talks with First Minister Nicola Sturgeon in Edinburgh on the future of the EU and the union.
Mrs May left the first minister's official residence, Bute House, after about 45 minutes, following a meeting she described as "positive".
She said the Scottish government should be "fully engaged" in Brexit talks.
Ms Sturgeon believes Scottish interests have been put "at risk" by the UK's vote to leave the EU." (Posters comment what absolute rubbish).
"The Scottish government is seeking a separate deal on relations with the EU after the Brexit vote". (Posters comment well that's a non-starter)
"Speaking after the meeting, the prime minister said: "I'm willing to listen to options and I've been very clear with the first minister today that I want the Scottish government to be fully engaged in our discussion".
Poster's comment: why should the Queen have to 'speak' to Mrs Sturgeon as only the Queen does and now The Prime Minister has had to 'speak' to her.
Time Mrs Sturgeon grew up, fell into line and acted in the best interests of the whole nation and took up a patriotic unionist position. Who does she think she is, Queen of Scots!
If Mrs Sturgeon had an ounce of courtesy and good manners, she would have substituted one with the Union flag. Surprised she did not have the EU flag.
"From the BBC Prime Minister Theresa May has held talks with First Minister Nicola Sturgeon in Edinburgh on the future of the EU and the union.
Mrs May left the first minister's official residence, Bute House, after about 45 minutes, following a meeting she described as "positive".
She said the Scottish government should be "fully engaged" in Brexit talks.
Ms Sturgeon believes Scottish interests have been put "at risk" by the UK's vote to leave the EU." (Posters comment what absolute rubbish).
"The Scottish government is seeking a separate deal on relations with the EU after the Brexit vote". (Posters comment well that's a non-starter)
"Speaking after the meeting, the prime minister said: "I'm willing to listen to options and I've been very clear with the first minister today that I want the Scottish government to be fully engaged in our discussion".
Poster's comment: why should the Queen have to 'speak' to Mrs Sturgeon as only the Queen does and now The Prime Minister has had to 'speak' to her.
Time Mrs Sturgeon grew up, fell into line and acted in the best interests of the whole nation and took up a patriotic unionist position. Who does she think she is, Queen of Scots!
Last edited:
Shutterbug
Well-Known Member
Oh dear you are seriously going to get wound up about a flag?? Are you really old or something? Thats the kind of thing my grandparents would whine about. Newsflash, we have moved on and no longer get our knickers in a twist about trivial crap. She's in the Scottish Parliament for goodness sake we aren't going to chuck up a flag just to passify the likes of you.
Of course the PM has to speak to her she's the FM of Scotland. Wow you have a real bee in your bonnet don't you? She's not the Queen of Scotland no, you're right there, she is the democratically selected leader of the Scottish Government representing the country of Scotland and the 62% of voters who voted remain. It's her job to represent their opinions and hats what she's doing because that's what we want her to do. Doing anything else would betray the votes of all those who voted her in
Of course the PM has to speak to her she's the FM of Scotland. Wow you have a real bee in your bonnet don't you? She's not the Queen of Scotland no, you're right there, she is the democratically selected leader of the Scottish Government representing the country of Scotland and the 62% of voters who voted remain. It's her job to represent their opinions and hats what she's doing because that's what we want her to do. Doing anything else would betray the votes of all those who voted her in
Last edited:
Judgemental
Well-Known Member
No simply good manners and yes.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
Err, so I'm sure it would work really well if the decided that NS and TM didn't have to speak to each other in their respective roles, that would work really well.
and flags, I find it a constant source of confusion why they are such an issue for people. Same as with NI when issues are listed as 'flags, parades and the past' in that order!
and flags, I find it a constant source of confusion why they are such an issue for people. Same as with NI when issues are listed as 'flags, parades and the past' in that order!
Judgemental
Well-Known Member
Well if NS was not 'kicking off' TM would not have to have so high on her agenda.
So far as flags are concerned, in the US everybody swears allegiance to The Flag, we are rather different and swear allegiance to the crown.
Swearing allegiance to a flag is a republican 'thing' and I cannot help wondering if that is what NS is really after, abolishing the crown in Scotland.
Having some misguided notions about grouse moors and pipe smoking tweedy politicians from London. Whatever the criticism of such people, they always had impeccable manners.
Last edited:
ester
Not slacking multitasking
Did you know them all?
I am sure, as a woman, TM is fine at multitasking and having many things on her agenda without them affecting others adversely.
It sounds like remembering to get the awful vase that aunty ethel bought you one year out when she visits..., even though aunty ethel can't remember buying the bloody thing. Essentially pointless and I would hope they both have much more important things to be spending their time and energy on than bits of cloth, flagged, tweeded or otherwise.
I am sure, as a woman, TM is fine at multitasking and having many things on her agenda without them affecting others adversely.
It sounds like remembering to get the awful vase that aunty ethel bought you one year out when she visits..., even though aunty ethel can't remember buying the bloody thing. Essentially pointless and I would hope they both have much more important things to be spending their time and energy on than bits of cloth, flagged, tweeded or otherwise.