When you're done with horses but horse is unsellable?

I think there is confusion going on with this thread between what is being interpreted as advice for others and what is actually only people trying to defend themselves against accusations that they "can't be arsed" or are "morally bankrupt" for not retiring horses or finding them new homes.

We are all different, we should all do what we personally feel is right for our animals and ourselves.
.
 
greenbean10 said:
I agree and am getting completely confused by the point some posters are trying to make.

Yes, a retired horse can be in pain and you may not be able to tell, so can ridden horses. Does that mean we should put all horses down on the off chance that they are in some degree of pain but no one has spotted it?

Is anyone else completely lost?
Click to expand...
Yes totally
 
Fieldlife said:
I think field sound is defined as different things by different people . . .

Some people - field sound = visibly clearly lame in trot at all times.
Other people field sound = fully sound if not ridden / worked.
Yet more people field sound = sound if not on a circle or hard ground or sound most of the time.

Think the definition varies and you are using the first definition, but not everyone else is using that definition.
Click to expand...

I don't think I'm using the first definition. The second is closer to what I would expect from a horse that's retired to the field. I would say that my mare was field sound in that sense. If she'd be clearly lame in trot then she wouldn't have gone on. I have no quarrel with people who choose to PTS if they think that's the best thing for the horse. Over the years I've been more concerned for ponies/horses where the owner wouldn't PTS than I have for those that do. If I go under a bus tomorrow it's in my will that my pony will be PTS. He's had so many health issues that I would never be able to trust that someone else would look after him properly.
 
ycbm said:
I think there is confusion going on with this thread between what is being interpreted as advice for others and what is actually only people trying to defend themselves against accusations that they "can't be arsed" or are "morally bankrupt" for not retiring horses or finding them new homes.

We are all different, we should all do what we personally feel is right for our animals and ourselves.
.
Click to expand...

Re your last statement, yes, we should, but tbh what we "personally feel is right for our animals and ourselves" really can turn out to be a poor choice for the animal. Some people personally feel it's ok for the animals and themselves not to have teeth done, or hooves trimmed regularly, or a saddle fitted, or fed a certain way. So while I understand what you're saying, it's a statement that can just feel so empty to a cynic like me.

That being said, I appreciate that we all have varying circumstances, standards, and limitations. So we do our best (in theory) with what we have. I don't agree with what many people think, do, or would do on this thread and feel that in some cases, the animal may suffer, but what can I do about it, really.

We all have horses for selfish reasons at the end of the day, and some people are incredibly inept and wouldn't know a horse in pain if it came up to them and kicked them in the face. So many people are clueless re horse behavior and mannerisms. I can spend all day getting frustrated over it, but rather not. My views have really changed over the last few years alone, and I think about horses a bit differently now.

I also believe that euthanasia is not the worst thing to happen to a horse. It's like some people think that the horse knows and will never forgive them. Um, the horse will be dead. The horse is not coming back in ghost form and saying "Omg you killed me! How could you! I had plans to play bitey face over the fence with Dobbin next Wednesday! And was looking forward to second cutting hay." We (generally) project our feelings and other humanisms onto animals. That doesn't mean that horses don't have feelings or aren't expressive, but they're not humans.

The horse might sense something is going on differently today, then it gets a needle (like it's likely gotten before for sedation) and next thing you know it's pts. Or shot (which is quick). There's no "build up" for the horse or anything afterward, that's purely the human.

If you're (general) in a situation and euthanasia is an option, even due to finances, it's not the worst thing for the horse.

I recently sold a horse, and quite frankly found the experience to be terrifying. It was my personal horse that I cared very much about and the sale was somewhat forced (whether he was loaned or sold be wouldn't he with me). There were times when I thought... "if he died or were pts this would be easier because I'd know his fate" perfectly good and sound horse, too. Yes, it would have been "killing" him but he had good years on this planet and wouldn't have known he had more to live, or not.

There are too many horses and crocked horses roaming this earth that are poorly managed, I don't want to contribute to that number if I can help it.

If you choose to euthanize a horse when it's riding career has ended, that's not the worst thing, IMO. Idk why some believe that wandering around a field half crippled is a fantastic and well earned retirement. I also know an older mare who will have to be pts when her ridden career is over. She does not do no riding/work/living in a field. Does not. I fully support her owner and understand why retirement isn't possible for that individual. When she's lame or too crocked to ride, it's over. Simple.

Ok, that was long, sorry ?

Edit: I swear I'm not illiterate, forgive my auto correct typos. I'm typing quickly on a mobile phone.
 
Last edited:
Gallop_Away said:
Some pretty horrid comments on this thread all round ? it really is a shame how nasty the equine community can be towards each other on times. We all love our horses and try to do our best for them. I don't think it's helpful or kind to throw out the comments I have read throughout this thread; to question people's morals, label them bad owners, claim you know better than qualified vets, or indeed imply someone has had their horse pts because they can not be bothered to seek an alternative.

Please remember that we have no idea what people have gone through or are currently going through in the respect of a decision to retire a horse or have it pts, and try to be a bit kinder towards one another?
Click to expand...
I think we should all just be kind to each other, you never know what is in store for you or what someone is going through m. Any one of us can be in the exact same position some day.
 
greenbean10 said:
I agree and am getting completely confused by the point some posters are trying to make.

Yes, a retired horse can be in pain and you may not be able to tell, so can ridden horses. Does that mean we should put all horses down on the off chance that they are in some degree of pain but no one has spotted it?

Is anyone else completely lost?
Click to expand...
My hubby says I should be put down ? when Im moaning about my arthritis lmao
 
Chianti said:
I don't think I'm using the first definition. The second is closer to what I would expect from a horse that's retired to the field. I would say that my mare was field sound in that sense. If she'd be clearly lame in trot then she wouldn't have gone on. I have no quarrel with people who choose to PTS if they think that's the best thing for the horse. Over the years I've been more concerned for ponies/horses where the owner wouldn't PTS than I have for those that do. If I go under a bus tomorrow it's in my will that my pony will be PTS. He's had so many health issues that I would never be able to trust that someone else would look after him properly.
Click to expand...

I don’t know anyone who uses the first definition, always that the are sound of no athletic expectation is put on them, I thought that was the obvious definition ?
 
The Fuzzy Furry said:
Because they perceive everything is personally aimed st them, each and every word.... then get furious and come out with unpleasant name calling and denigrating posts, if you dont pat them on the head?

I find life much easier to have that person on ignore ?

Guys, whatever or however you choose to manage or despatch your ailing or elderly, is your decision, most take this wisely and some seek educated help.
I think most of us here work to the same common factor x
Click to expand...

Lol, this exactly
 
It is interesting to see how views, and indeed laws, on euthanasia vary from country to country.

Where I am a vet may not put a horse to sleep without a specific diagnosis to show that it would be in pain if kept retired. Of course with old horses this is easy, as the diagnosis can be 'old age', but with younger horses it is a genuine problem that in practice does lead to suffering. In many cases owners do not have the money to spend on investigations, so horses are just turned out.

Likewise financial issues are not enough to allow a vet to PTS, even if the animal could not be realistically sold. The owner is allowed to send it on the meat wagon, mainly to be sent for animal food as most horses do not qualify to be in the human food chain, but this is something which involves genuine suffering and I would not wish it on any animal. This baffles me honestly, that an owner of a horse who they can see is in pain may be forced to keep it alive just to avoid sending it on the meat truck, and they may not be able to afford a good standard of care.

This is the same with dogs. If tomorrow I could not afford to keep my dogs I could legally drop them at a public shelter, but could not PTS. Realistically only 1 of them would have any chance of being adopted, so the shelter would keep them in cages for some months before having them PTS as not suitable for adoption. In the meantime the animal would suffer. Nonsense.

On the other hand I do understand why rules are there. No disrespect to anyone with different opinions, but I could not bring myself to put one of my horses down just so that I could replace it with something new to ride. We are all different, and I understand why some do this, but I do find it a little confusing when people talk about 'losing a beloved family member', when the reality is that the horse could be safely retired, and it is only PTS so s/he can be replaced. I just do not believe that if this is your choice you can expect a lot of sympathy for your 'loss'.

I realize that this may be a controversial view, and that I am fortunate to be able to retire them and still have others to ride, but this was not always the case, I have in the past had to do without a ridden horse in order to have sufficient funds to care for an oldie, but so be it. I do not claim to have an answer as to what is 'right' or 'wrong', but I can definitely see a lot of negatives in having a system where the financial position of the owner is not taken into account in the decision as to whether or not euthanasia is allowed.
 
Winters100 said:
It is interesting to see how views, and indeed laws, on euthanasia vary from country to country.

Where I am a vet may not put a horse to sleep without a specific diagnosis to show that it would be in pain if kept retired. Of course with old horses this is easy, as the diagnosis can be 'old age', but with younger horses it is a genuine problem that in practice does lead to suffering. In many cases owners do not have the money to spend on investigations, so horses are just turned out.

Likewise financial issues are not enough to allow a vet to PTS, even if the animal could not be realistically sold. The owner is allowed to send it on the meat wagon, mainly to be sent for animal food as most horses do not qualify to be in the human food chain, but this is something which involves genuine suffering and I would not wish it on any animal. This baffles me honestly, that an owner of a horse who they can see is in pain may be forced to keep it alive just to avoid sending it on the meat truck, and they may not be able to afford a good standard of care.

This is the same with dogs. If tomorrow I could not afford to keep my dogs I could legally drop them at a public shelter, but could not PTS. Realistically only 1 of them would have any chance of being adopted, so the shelter would keep them in cages for some months before having them PTS as not suitable for adoption. In the meantime the animal would suffer. Nonsense.

On the other hand I do understand why rules are there. No disrespect to anyone with different opinions, but I could not bring myself to put one of my horses down just so that I could replace it with something new to ride. We are all different, and I understand why some do this, but I do find it a little confusing when people talk about 'losing a beloved family member', when the reality is that the horse could be safely retired, and it is only PTS so s/he can be replaced. I just do not believe that if this is your choice you can expect a lot of sympathy for your 'loss'.

I realize that this may be a controversial view, and that I am fortunate to be able to retire them and still have others to ride, but this was not always the case, I have in the past had to do without a ridden horse in order to have sufficient funds to care for an oldie, but so be it. I do not claim to have an answer as to what is 'right' or 'wrong', but I can definitely see a lot of negatives in having a system where the financial position of the owner is not taken into account in the decision as to whether or not euthanasia is allowed.
Click to expand...


It was the same, IME, in Germany.

Very difficult to get a vet to pts in my neck of the woods.

One woman actually drove her horse over the border to Belgium and the horse was then sold to the slaughter house. It was the only way she could end things for that horse (it actually was a quick end). He had so many ailments and wasn't pasture sound by any definition but was still "aware and expressive" according to the vet. She's not the only one that I knew who had to do this. It's amazing what they won't euthanize for. I've seen much suffering and poor health, but it still blinks so we can't euth it. ?
 
Winters100 said:
Where I am a vet may not put a horse to sleep without a specific diagnosis to show that it would be in pain if kept retired. Of course with old horses this is easy, as the diagnosis can be 'old age', but with younger horses it is a genuine problem that in practice does lead to suffering. In many cases owners do not have the money to spend on investigations, so horses are just turned out.


On the other hand I do understand why rules are there. No disrespect to anyone with different opinions, but I could not bring myself to put one of my horses down just so that I could replace it with something new to ride. We are all different, and I understand why some do this, but I do find it a little confusing when people talk about 'losing a beloved family member', when the reality is that the horse could be safely retired, and it is only PTS so s/he can be replaced. I just do not believe that if this is your choice you can expect a lot of sympathy for your 'loss'.

I realize that this may be a controversial view, and that I am fortunate to be able to retire them and still have others to ride, but this was not always the case, I have in the past had to do without a ridden horse in order to have sufficient funds to care for an oldie, but so be it. I do not claim to have an answer as to what is 'right' or 'wrong', but I can definitely see a lot of negatives in having a system where the financial position of the owner is not taken into account in the decision as to whether or not euthanasia is allowed.
Click to expand...

I think I am glad to live in England.

Re para 2 this is exactly my view. I don't keep mine at livery so I am lucky but I honestly don't think I could have a horse PTS that could go on to live a reasonable live unridden just to get a new riding horse. I would just dislike the new horse and always be thinking that I did wrong by the first one. If I couldn't afford 2 I would stick with the old one until it's life was clearly at an end.
I have had to do this in the past when we simply couldn't take on any more horses because we had too many. We were overhorsed not with riding horses but because we had taken on rescue cases that had little hope of being ridden due to their earlier treatment. So in fact they were pretty useless but physically healthy and happy so no way would I have PTS just so I could have a new riding horse.

I too realise it may be controversial but each to their own. To me an animal, be it dog, horse, cat or any other is for life until it is in pain and must be PTS. (it's life)
 
Orangehorse said:
Gosh, that's awful, poor horses. Here you don't have to get a vet, there are "fallen stock" people who will come and PTS any animal, and they are professional and very quick. It is done with a gun which some people don't like, but they do it every day so are well practiced. They then take the animal away.
Click to expand...
I use a vet but in the circumstances of Winters post I would happily use a knackerman. Here farmers shoot their own horses. No idea how efficiently. I found one of mine starving in a barn awaiting that fate. (so he joined the retirement scheme!) :p:p

Winters do you not have knackermen/fallen stock men or even the hunt in Poland? (or GermanyCC)
 
ycbm said:
Unfortunately anyone with arthritis or a similar condition will tell you that no amount of drugs will remove the pain completely. I hear of vets telling owners that they can control the pain after colic surgery. Yeah, tell that to someone who had a C-section last week.
.
Click to expand...

No ,this is not so the right medication will completely remove arthritic pain in all but the most seriously damaged joints .
 
You know, I’m really disappointed in this thread, people I genuinely had sympathy for I now don’t feel as much. I got hell for putting Kia down. Some of the messages I got were disgusting. He was 30+ yrs old, had cushings and 3/4 of his hoof was pus due to a massive infection that the cushings just fed and his teeth were done, but apparently I only put him down so I could have Faran and that was the nicest thing said to me in some of these messages.

PTS is a personal thing and I would never have a go at people for doing what they feel is right in putting a horse to rest.

OP I’m another who wouldn’t ever make anyone in your situation feel bad for putting a horse to rest. Take care of yourself
 
Cheeky Chestnut said:
You know, I’m really disappointed in this thread, people I genuinely had sympathy for I now don’t feel as much. I got hell for putting Kia down. Some of the messages I got were disgusting. He was 30+ yrs old, had cushings and 3/4 of his hoof was pus due to a massive infection that the cushings just fed and his teeth were done, but apparently I only put him down so I could have Faran and that was the nicest thing said to me in some of these messages.

PTS is a personal thing and I would never have a go at people for doing what they feel is right in putting a horse to rest.

OP I’m another who wouldn’t ever make anyone in your situation feel bad for putting a horse to rest. Take care of yourself
Click to expand...
It is absolutely disgusting you were treated like that! It is bullying in its worst form which there is a lot of ??‍♀️
 
Barton Bounty said:
It is absolutely disgusting you were treated like that! It is bullying in its worst form which there is a lot of ??‍♀️
Click to expand...

Thank you ❤️

Honestly it was hell for about three weeks afterwards, if I hadn’t been as solid in my resolve about his best interests I think it would have ended me. Showed me the other side of people let me tell you.
 
Cheeky Chestnut said:
Thank you ❤️

Honestly it was hell for about three weeks afterwards, if I hadn’t been as solid in my resolve about his best interests I think it would have ended me. Showed me the other side of people let me tell you.
Click to expand...
I can imagine! Like I said before, we could all easily be in that fated position at some point so should never judge for doing the right thing, if you have exhausted your options the best and kindest thing of love you can do for your animal is give it the most peaceful ending.
I had an ID 19 years ago and I only had him for about a year and he got kicked in the field by the bully horse, unfortunately it caused an infection in the bone super quick and even though I sent him at 23 years old to the vet school, they tried for 10 days to save him but couldnt , its the hardest thing to do but also the kindest.
 
Goldenstar said:
No ,this is not so the right medication will completely remove arthritic pain in all but the most seriously damaged joints .
Click to expand...

I really dont think it does at all. My grandmother who lived to her 90s was in a lot of pain from arthritis despite all sorts of heavy duty painkillers. Morphine didnt take the pain away, just made her sleep and not care. Obviously, at 90plus she had fairly damaged joints but even in her 60s when it started, she struggled despite pain relief.

You hear people say the same thing over and over. I know paracetamol wont touch the aching in bones I've broken either, but I dont take anything stronger yet.
 
I have no wish to get into an ethical debate about when is the right or appropriate time to pts; I would just hope that everyone recognises that this never going to be an easy decision and people are kind and respectful to each other. I was very saddened to just see a post on one of the Dodgy Dealer sites from someone who had given away their twenty three year old intermittently lame horse, who wasn't easy to ride to someone as a "light hack" to someone who turned out to be a dealer and had immediately advertised the horse for sale without disclosing any of the horse's issues. In this very specific type of situation in my view pts rather than facing an uncertain future would have been a kinder option for the horse.
 
Goldenstar said:
No ,this is not so the right medication will completely remove arthritic pain in all but the most seriously damaged joints .
Click to expand...
This is wrong, some pain is actually is never resolved by medication, as we are all different, there are some drugs we do not fully understand how they work, but they do, then every person reacts to them is differently.
I have given out pain meds and had large doses of them, so I know from experience that it's often finding the right cocktail, and then tolerating a certain amount of discomfort, or you spend your time in a drugged fog. My fav is IV paracetamol, for me its like an internal hot water bottle, tops up the stronger drugs. My trade to come off all my pain meds was to just take paracetamol, and try and ignore the rest, but I had the stuff to literally knock myself out in the cupboard if I needed it. I have friends who are on long term strong pain meds, not with joint pain,and it's often a trade over function, the side effects can life controlling, over pain management.
There is also a problem with neuropathic pain, where the nerves become so damaged, sometimes by the medication themselves, that they never fully switch off. This means that something that may have worked, through nerve damage may no longer work or the nerve damage burn is worse than the pain that you started off with.

My advice to anyone who is thinking of having something PTS, don't tell anyone, unless you know they are going to be fully supportive. Over forty years I have had many PTS, its never easy, and I only tell my husband what I am thinking, that is the only opinion I care about.
 
paddy555 said:
I use a vet but in the circumstances of Winters post I would happily use a knackerman. Here farmers shoot their own horses. No idea how efficiently. I found one of mine starving in a barn awaiting that fate. (so he joined the retirement scheme!) :p:p

Winters do you not have knackermen/fallen stock men or even the hunt in Poland? (or GermanyCC)
Click to expand...

No, no knackerman or hunt. The truth is that some ask their vet to attend for a 'colic' that results in PTS, but for this you need to have a very close relationship with your vet. Also most vets are very reluctant to do this on livery yards for obvious reasons. I know that my own vet would not be willing, so I would have to find some other solution.
 
Cheeky Chestnut said:
You know, I’m really disappointed in this thread, people I genuinely had sympathy for I now don’t feel as much. I got hell for putting Kia down. Some of the messages I got were disgusting. He was 30+ yrs old, had cushings and 3/4 of his hoof was pus due to a massive infection that the cushings just fed and his teeth were done, but apparently I only put him down so I could have Faran and that was the nicest thing said to me in some of these messages.

PTS is a personal thing and I would never have a go at people for doing what they feel is right in putting a horse to rest.

OP I’m another who wouldn’t ever make anyone in your situation feel bad for putting a horse to rest. Take care of yourself
Click to expand...
That is awful that people on this forum harrased you for PTS a 30 year old horse in pain !!!
 
marmalade76 said:
Was rather shocked to see a well known and well respected equine college advertising a horse for a companion only home on Facebook earlier today ? Gone are the days of taking a lorry load to Potters.
Click to expand...
Do you personally know the horse, its history, vets reports and whether that horse could be a companion in a home vetted by the college with some sort of contract in place to look after its best interests? No you don't therefore you are not best placed to comment on what is probably a much loved horse. The horse may not even have physical issues, they be mental issues and if it does have physical issues I'm sure they have been fully investigated and treated and advised by their vet, as indeed have I, that our horses can retire pain free without medication.

With respect I don't know how you can comment on this without the factual evidence to hand.
 
So loved that they are looking for a "forever home" elsewhere for a teenaged horse that "is not suitable for ridden work". Lucky horse to be loved that much. Loved until they are no longer rideable seems to be the common theme.

People who love their unrideable horses don't wash their hands of them and slope them off somewhere else. They look after them for the rest of their natural, suffering free, life or they do the responsible thing to stop the horse ending up on a slippery slope.

This forum has been full of horses loaned/sold/gifted as companions that have been sold on as riding horses. It wasn't that long ago that a loaned horse was sold and then ended up in a dodgy "rescue" being rehomed to a novice while underweight and lame.

The mental gymnastics some posters are prepared to do is astounding.
 
Last edited:
NR88 said:
So loved that they are looking for a "forever home" elsewhere for a teenaged horse that "is not suitable for ridden work". Lucky horse to be loved that much. Loved until they are no longer rideable seems to be the common theme.

People who love their unrideable horses don't wash their hands of them and slope them off somewhere else. They look after them for the rest of their natural, suffering free, life or they do the responsible thing to stop the horse ending up on a slippery slope.

This forum has been full of horses loaned/sold/gifted as companions that have been sold on as riding horses. It wasn't that long ago that a loaned horse was sold and then ended up in a dodgy "rescue" being rehomed to a novice while underweight and lame.

The mental gymnastics some posters are prepared to do is astounding.
Click to expand...
I just don't undrrstand your POV. Like I said exactly who are we to judge when we don't know the horse or its history? I can understand you commenting on your own horse but not a horse you don't know.

I'm sure the college can make a determined decision on whether any home that is offered is suitable and a contract drawn up. Just because a horse can't be ridden anymore doesn't mean its curtains, you have to base a judgement on what is in front of you and the idividual needs of that horse, whose problem may not even be physical.

You can't be judge , jury and executioner to something you don't know. You can't possibly know that pts is the only way for this horse. And I'm sure because the owners want to try and find a future for this beloved horse they be appalled at your attitude that they are 'washing their hands of him and sloping off' like I am appalled at the suggestion that I am doing the same for my horse.

But whatever....
 
Last edited:
Winters100 said:
No disrespect to anyone with different opinions, but I could not bring myself to put one of my horses down just so that I could replace it with something new to ride. We are all different, and I understand why some do this, but I do find it a little confusing when people talk about 'losing a beloved family member', when the reality is that the horse could be safely retired, and it is only PTS so s/he can be replaced. I just do not believe that if this is your choice you can expect a lot of sympathy for your 'loss'.

I realize that this may be a controversial view, and that I am fortunate to be able to retire them and still have others to ride, but this was not always the case, I have in the past had to do without a ridden horse in order to have sufficient funds to care for an oldie, but so be it. I do not claim to have an answer as to what is 'right' or 'wrong', but I can definitely see a lot of negatives in having a system where the financial position of the owner is not taken into account in the decision as to whether or not euthanasia is allowed.
Click to expand...

For those that think I am making it 'all about me' :rolleyes: I am not but I am just addressing your post as you bring up some interesting points.

Until I was in this very position I did not think I could do it and I'm sure there are many on here that echo the same sentiments.

But your experience differs from mine and maybe the OP's in that you have your own land I assume unless you are mega rich and on a livery yard are therefore able to retire all these horses you have retired and therefore fortunate. I am also guessing that the horse you did retire was one you'd had for more than 11 months. :)

So my horse is on a livery yard, I am a one horse owner, scraping by every week.

I firstly looked at keeping my horse where he is but not riding again but just know I can't do that, I bought him to ride and having him less than a year don't feel that I 'owe him anything'. However, after reaching that state of mind (which took many sleepless nights and a great deal of tears) I then decided I would retire him, and get another horse. I was determined that I would do this and when I ended up in debt I would eventually pay it off. However, as someone who struggles being even £10 overdrawn at the end of the week, I knew it would be financial suicide to get in debt to the thousands that I would have been, my salary just cannot support two horses.

So then after a great deal of soul searching, asking opinions of others, having to go onto anti depressants to cope with it all I thought the blood bank would be a brilliant option for him as he is not needle shy, has been out with a herd of horse previously and can remain as pain free as the vets can predict without medication. So this was the next option for him and I was glad I could find a solution which may have worked well for him.

I do not know if he can go the blood bank yet, so in January I will get to find out when I have to ring them back. If he can't then I may have to pts but first I will investigate having riding lessons or finding a horse I can ride a couple of times a week (my weight is presently holding me back as due to the stress of this momentous decision I have to make I am overeating again and have lost all motivation for the gym). So all is not lost.

Only once when I have exhausted all possibilities will I be faced with the decision I am dreading and that is to put to sleep a perfectly happy, lovable, kind, and much loved horse in order to have another and it is not a decision I will take lightly, believe me, I am currently not coping with it very well and I'm finding it very sad and soul destroying and constantly thinking about it on a daily basis. Hence why I have responded so many times on this post as so many things relate to my situation (as have many others that aren't pulled up constantly) and those amongst you on this forum that are capable of having some form of empathy and compassion towards another human being who is clearly struggling with their decision, as is the OP would actually realise that this is why, and not because 'I am making it all about me'.

Believe me when I say that Lari is a very much loved member of the family and his needs will always come first.
And I am really done with this thread now.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top