Another fatal dog attack

[skinnydipper]

.

 

[misst]

He does look very frightened and I do feel sorry for him. He is a living creature but the humans responsible for his breeding and life after birth will probably never pay the price they should for what they have done.I would still, personally prefer a gentle PTS for him as future will likely always be uncertain.

 

[SilverLinings]

Northern Ireland is now being pushed by the government to make a decision on whether to ban XLBs:

XL bully dogs: Ban decision 'needed shortly' in Northern Ireland

Northern Ireland is now the only UK jurisdiction with no active plans to ban the dog breed.

www.bbc.co.uk

When are owners going to accept their responsibility* and register and muzzle their dogs rather than shipping them off to another part of the UK/another country claiming that they aren't safe in England like they are some sort of hero saving the dog's life, rather than a bad owner dumping their dog on someone else as soon as it becomes a bit more like hard work or is going to cost them a few more pounds.

*obviously many have, but there seems to be an awful lot who haven't.

 

[rara007]

Cost them a few more pounds but most importantly be no use to breed from.

 

[Smitty]

.View attachment 132126View attachment 132127

The photo of Romeo is the harsh reality of what happens when the breeder doesn't give a stuff, the purchaser of a puppy has no commitment beyond what suits them and I just don't know where to go after that. To me the buck stops with breeder or owner.

Dreadfully sorry for this poor animal. Nothing is his fault.

 

[SilverLinings]

The stories about Romeo and other dumped XLBs show how little thought many people put into buying a dog, and how little they care for them. I'm pretty sure that if another breed was banned tomorrow, say one without a reputation for being bought to look tough e.g. Labradors or spaniels, we would see a repeat of the dumping and deserting that we have seen with the XLBs. I can't believe how many people seem to see dogs (and other animals) as 'things', inanimate objects with no needs or feelings.

 

[splashgirl45]

If they said all lurchers had to be muzzled by the end of jan I would have already muzzle trained him so he is calm about it… some of these XL bully owners shouldn’t have any dog as they obviously don’t care enough to comply with any rules, they just say that our gov is killing them, which is rubbish, it’s the owners behaviour that will get them killed

 

[Smitty]

The stories about Romeo and other dumped XLBs show how little thought many people put into buying a dog, and how little they care for them. I'm pretty sure that if another breed was banned tomorrow, say one without a reputation for being bought to look tough e.g. Labradors or spaniels, we would see a repeat of the dumping and deserting that we have seen with the XLBs. I can't believe how many people seem to see dogs (and other animals) as 'things', inanimate objects with no needs or feelings.

This exactly.

 

[Smitty]

Jogger jumped in river to escape being killed by dangerous dog

The owner received a suspended sentence and the pet was destroyed.

www.express.co.uk

This sounds absolutely terrifying and the woman had the audacity to ask for her "pet" to be spared destruction!!!

 

[Jenko109]

A suspended sentence and made to pay a few quid. Absurd.

 

[stormox]

How much does it actually cost to register a banned breed now? Muzzles can be bought for a few quid, castration/speying a couple of hundred..... surely not a huge expense altogether.

 

[conniegirl]

How much does it actually cost to register a banned breed now? Muzzles can be bought for a few quid, castration/speying a couple of hundred..... surely not a huge expense altogether.

£96 for the exemption cert i believe

 

[Jenko109]

How much does it actually cost to register a banned breed now? Muzzles can be bought for a few quid, castration/speying a couple of hundred..... surely not a huge expense altogether.

Well exactly.

Anyone who has animals should have access to money for the unexpected.

Last Monday I took my GSD x BC to the vets for some unknown cyst type things. Getting them tested and consult totalled £240. The outcome was not entirely conclusive but most probably just normal cysts so we are going to monitor them so I wont bother claiming on insurance as our excess is £150 and no doubt they would hit me with a meaty increase. All for £70 after the fee for vet completing claim form.

I am going to take my lurcher to the vets tomorrow for arthritis symptoms. So that is a further expense.

Dogs cost money. They are a privilege. If you cannot afford the bare basics of a neuter or a poxy muzzle, then don't have dogs!

 

[Cinnamontoast]

 

[maisie06]

Oooh, now that IS interesting. Puts the onus on the owners!

Being a bit critical here

Who knew that this wasn't going to end up all sunshine & roses for these dogs?

I'm surprised they haven't tried to ship them to Romania yet...

 

[maisie06]

That was me… anything that I get in my fb reels being used for bite work with no ears I tend to group together. I do know I shouldn’t. My farrier had a CC X GSD. She was lovely, well socialised but I would not have crossed her, or gone near his van.

A friend lives alone in a rural area - she has a cane Corso and Huge lab cross, both dogs are a delight in the house with people they know but I wouldn;t cross either.

 

[JoannaC]

If they said all lurchers had to be muzzled by the end of jan I would have already muzzle trained him so he is calm about it… some of these XL bully owners shouldn’t have any dog as they obviously don’t care enough to comply with any rules, they just say that our gov is killing them, which is rubbish, it’s the owners behaviour that will get them killed

Exactly, I always muzzled our lurcher when out and about for my own peace of mind. She was a real softy but would bark at anything moving fast and I was always worried she might mistake a small fluffy dog for something to chase and kill.

 

[Clodagh]

I went to Exeter the other day, there are an awful lot of homeless people there. Two men were walking along together, one with a whippety thing wearing muzzle, harness and a lead and his friend with an XL just on a normal collar. It just tickled me. And no I didn’t phone the police, they seemed to be busy arresting all the other homeless people just along the street.

 

[scruffyponies]

I have three large dogs, and I'm horrified by the new legislation.
The description of the banned 'type' is so vague that most of the criteria would fit just about any dog, and are neither measurable nor specific ("nose has open nostrils", FFS), yet meeting just 60% is apparently enough to condemn a cross-breed.
No official, vet or police will give you an assessment of your dog, or confirm whether your dog has a 'wide chest', 'straight pasterns' a 'broad head' or 'muscular legs'. How much muscle on a dog's leg is too much? Is a fit dog a bully but not a fat one?
If you don't exempt, your dog can be seized for assessment (up to 2 years suffering in police kennels?), if you do, you can't take it camping without having a muzzle on 24/7 (including when eating or you're breaking the law), and your pet insurance is instantly void. They can never fetch a ball or pick up a stick, and if the muzzle comes off or is removed for welfare reasons (say the dog is being sick), then one call from any Tom, Dick or Karen is enough to have your dog destroyed. There is no assessment. Temperament and training will not save it. Responsible owners are terrified, and most genuinely don't know if their dog meets 'type' or what to do for the best.

Strangely, despite hundreds of badly cared for xl bullies being suddenly dumped on the streets by irresponsible owners, not one of them seems to have bitten anyone.

Bull mastiff x Rottweiler (37kg), Ridgeback x Cane Corso (36kg). Presa Canario (32kg). No rabbits were injured in the making of this photo.

 

[marmalade76]

Why would anyone cross a bull mastiff with a Rottweiler and a CC with an RR??There needs to be much tighter controls on dog breeding & ownership if you ask me.

 

[scruffyponies]

The BMxrottie is quite a common cross. Lots of common ancestry, so a consistent result, generally producing a healthy dog due to the larger gene pool.
The two breeds are also generally steady, placid reliable dogs, so if you're not hung up on breed purity why not? Alice here has been perfect every day of her life.
I won't defend breeding a RR x CC - Nox is a lovely dog, but it's a dopey cross

Both were rescues, bred because their owners loved their dog and thought it would be nice to have puppies. Sadly suitable homes for such puppies are hard to come by.
My good friend took Nox's sister, so we get them together from time to time. Both are good dogs.

 

[CorvusCorax]

This is not a comment on anyone's individual dogs but being 'hung up on breed purity' means you have a better chance to prove what your dog is/isn't, as more punitive measures are taken against dogs because breeders and owners aren't doing due diligence.

People had the chance to use a nutcracker but didn't, that's why the sledgehammer is being utilised.

 

[Cortez]

I can't understand what's so horrifying about the requirements, lots of dogs wear muzzles as part of their everyday getup, (greyhounds for instance) without it impinging on their enjoyment of life. If you want to throw a ball and don't have a large garden, there are places where you can bring them to do that. If you have proof of your dogs breeding then there would be no confusion, and none of them look like XL or pitbulls to me. I think your fears are ungrounded.

 

[scruffyponies]

Mine won't be affected by this legislation, not least because of our social situation (how can that be acceptable?). Sadly because they won't stop at bullies, we have muzzle trained, just in case.

Just because I won't be affected, doesn't make it right. The law is badly thought through. Do you expect someone to keep a dog muzzled 24/7 if they go away in a motorhome, for example? The law does. How can it be right that they can have no respite, even to eat? It's impractical and totally unreasonable, especially if the dog is of good character, elderly or very young. The thought of having to impose that on Alice, aged nearly 14 and the most trustworthy dog I have ever met, makes me weep.

The whole thing is just desperate distraction by government in deep trouble on a number of other fronts. The existing law allows seizure of dangerous animals, and if more is needed it should be targeted at the criminals who breed and use dogs as weapons, not the 1000s of pet owners who choose to pick up the pieces by offering a home to the poor discarded pups.

 

[I'm Dun]

Do you expect someone to keep a dog muzzled 24/7 if they go away in a motorhome, for example? The law does. How can it be right that they can have no respite, even to eat? It's impractical and totally unreasonable, especially if the dog is of good character, elderly or very young.

Sorry but thats just not true. When the motorhome is parked it is then considered a home and muzzles are not needed inside the home.

I still dont get why muzzling is such an horrific thing? If you own dogs big enough and powerful enough to kill a person, surely muzzling is the safer option for everyone dogs included.

 

[scruffyponies]

Sorry but thats just not true. When the motorhome is parked it is then considered a home and muzzles are not needed inside the home.

I still dont get why muzzling is such an horrific thing? If you own dogs big enough and powerful enough to kill a person, surely muzzling is the safer option for everyone dogs included.

A motorhome is a vehicle, in which the dog must not only muzzled, but on a lead, held by someone over 16 AT ALL TIMES. Tents, Caravans, cars; all are considered not to be 'private spaces', according to the responses from DEFRA that I have seen.

Muzzling is OK. Muzzling for indefinite periods of time, where there is no reasonable reason to do so, is not. Literal thousands of people own large dogs who do no harm to anyone. Statistically you're much more likely to be murdered by your husband than your dog.

BSL is the first step down a road where none of us are allowed to own dogs at all. After all, most injuries (including deaths) occur in the home, not out on a walk, and most biters aren't bull-breeds but herding breeds and terriers. Ask any postman.

 

[skinnydipper]

BSL is the first step down a road where none of us are allowed to own dogs at all

I think you are getting a bit carried away there. BSL was introduced in 1991.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

Many years ago before my marriage I had a beautiful labrador bitch that my then boyfriend (now husband) bought me as a birthday present. By the time we married and went on to have our first child my dog was about 5 years old. She was very well bred from a reputable breeder. Always excellent behaviour, very easy to train from day one, but, she could show the odd mini snarl at my terrier and once or twice at the vet. Never showed any intention of biting though, just a small 'keep away from me' warning. To be on the safe side we always muzzled her at the vets.

When our son was born we were obviously very careful that we never left her alone with the baby, not even for a minute. She had not shown any signs of jealousy, indeed her attitude was the usual goofy labrador snuffling around at the bottom of his high chair looking for scraps and wagging her tail while she did so. One day I was sitting on one side of the lounge with my labrador at my feet, watching my son at about 12/14 months of age climbing on the sofa at the other side of the room and bouncing up and down and laughing as he did so. In a split second the dog leapt up flew across the room and bit my son on the side of his face. Fortunately it was not a major bite, more like a small nip but it has left him with a small scar on one side of his eye. There was no provocation, nothing unusual going on, a totally normal afternoon indoors with the baby and the two dogs.

So should we have immediately put her to sleep? Many would say yes we should have done. Well we didn't, from that day onward she wore a muzzle from the moment I got up (before getting my son out of his cot) until the baby was put to bed in the evening. If for any reason I had to get my son up the dog would be shut in another room. She lived for another 8 years and by the time my child was about 3 we had a second baby so in total the dog wore the muzzle for about 6 of those 8 remaining years. She never rubbed at the muzzle, she never complained, she joined in all family activities as before, and she never growled or threatened either of the children ever again, but she did still occasionally mutter at the terrier, but then so did I! She would put her nose straight into the muzzle herself when I appeared in the mornings.

I think her life was still happy and fulfilled, and eventually she did become a very good and loyal companion to the boys and would trail around after them all day long in the summer out in the garden. She would even leap in the paddling pool to play with them.

Were we cruel to muzzle her like that? Were we wrong to have kept her after that first unprovoked attack on a very small child. I am only posting this as an example of how a dog can be muzzled without any adverse effects on its quality of life or having to be shut out in a yard like it seems a lot of family dogs are. I think half the owners of these dogs do not really care much for their dogs at all if the new regulations are enough to warrant dumping their dogs, having them put down etc. etc.

Ducks behind the parapet and awaits the attack.

 

[Clodagh]

Many years ago before my marriage I had a beautiful labrador bitch that my then boyfriend (now husband) bought me as a birthday present. By the time we married and went on to have our first child my dog was about 5 years old. She was very well bred from a reputable breeder. Always excellent behaviour, very easy to train from day one, but, she could show the odd mini snarl at my terrier and once or twice at the vet. Never showed any intention of biting though, just a small 'keep away from me' warning. To be on the safe side we always muzzled her at the vets.

When our son was born we were obviously very careful that we never left her alone with the baby, not even for a minute. She had not shown any signs of jealousy, indeed her attitude was the usual goofy labrador snuffling around at the bottom of his high chair looking for scraps and wagging her tail while she did so. One day I was sitting on one side of the lounge with my labrador at my feet, watching my son at about 12/14 months of age climbing on the sofa at the other side of the room and bouncing up and down and laughing as he did so. In a split second the dog leapt up flew across the room and bit my son on the side of his face. Fortunately it was not a major bite, more like a small nip but it has left him with a small scar on one side of his eye. There was no provocation, nothing unusual going on, a totally normal afternoon indoors with the baby and the two dogs.

So should we have immediately put her to sleep? Many would say yes we should have done. Well we didn't, from that day onward she wore a muzzle from the moment I got up (before getting my son out of his cot) until the baby was put to bed in the evening. If for any reason I had to get my son up the dog would be shut in another room. She lived for another 8 years and by the time my child was about 3 we had a second baby so in total the dog wore the muzzle for about 6 of those 8 remaining years. She never rubbed at the muzzle, she never complained, she joined in all family activities as before, and she never growled or threatened either of the children ever again, but she did still occasionally mutter at the terrier, but then so did I! She would put her nose straight into the muzzle herself when I appeared in the mornings.

I think her life was still happy and fulfilled, and eventually she did become a very good and loyal companion to the boys and would trail around after them all day long in the summer out in the garden. She would even leap in the paddling pool to play with them.

Were we cruel to muzzle her like that? Were we wrong to have kept her after that first unprovoked attack on a very small child. I am only posting this as an example of how a dog can be muzzled without any adverse effects on its quality of life or having to be shut out in a yard like it seems a lot of family dogs are. I think half the owners of these dogs do not really care much for their dogs at all if the new regulations are enough to warrant dumping their dogs, having them put down etc. etc.

Ducks behind the parapet and awaits the attack.

No attack but yes I’d have had her pts. I love my dogs, very very much but I love my children more.

ETA and I’ve had children and dogs together and the odd nip has happened. Mainly MIL’s terriers. But it was a situation where we didn’t need to keep them together.

 

[AmyMay]

Many years ago before my marriage I had a beautiful labrador bitch that my then boyfriend (now husband) bought me as a birthday present. By the time we married and went on to have our first child my dog was about 5 years old. She was very well bred from a reputable breeder. Always excellent behaviour, very easy to train from day one, but, she could show the odd mini snarl at my terrier and once or twice at the vet. Never showed any intention of biting though, just a small 'keep away from me' warning. To be on the safe side we always muzzled her at the vets.

When our son was born we were obviously very careful that we never left her alone with the baby, not even for a minute. She had not shown any signs of jealousy, indeed her attitude was the usual goofy labrador snuffling around at the bottom of his high chair looking for scraps and wagging her tail while she did so. One day I was sitting on one side of the lounge with my labrador at my feet, watching my son at about 12/14 months of age climbing on the sofa at the other side of the room and bouncing up and down and laughing as he did so. In a split second the dog leapt up flew across the room and bit my son on the side of his face. Fortunately it was not a major bite, more like a small nip but it has left him with a small scar on one side of his eye. There was no provocation, nothing unusual going on, a totally normal afternoon indoors with the baby and the two dogs.

So should we have immediately put her to sleep? Many would say yes we should have done. Well we didn't, from that day onward she wore a muzzle from the moment I got up (before getting my son out of his cot) until the baby was put to bed in the evening. If for any reason I had to get my son up the dog would be shut in another room. She lived for another 8 years and by the time my child was about 3 we had a second baby so in total the dog wore the muzzle for about 6 of those 8 remaining years. She never rubbed at the muzzle, she never complained, she joined in all family activities as before, and she never growled or threatened either of the children ever again, but she did still occasionally mutter at the terrier, but then so did I! She would put her nose straight into the muzzle herself when I appeared in the mornings.

I think her life was still happy and fulfilled, and eventually she did become a very good and loyal companion to the boys and would trail around after them all day long in the summer out in the garden. She would even leap in the paddling pool to play with them.

Were we cruel to muzzle her like that? Were we wrong to have kept her after that first unprovoked attack on a very small child. I am only posting this as an example of how a dog can be muzzled without any adverse effects on its quality of life or having to be shut out in a yard like it seems a lot of family dogs are. I think half the owners of these dogs do not really care much for their dogs at all if the new regulations are enough to warrant dumping their dogs, having them put down etc. etc.

Ducks behind the parapet and awaits the attack.

Brave post. I’m another who would have pts. But certainly wouldn’t vilify you for the direction you did take.

I guess had the dog shown any aggression towards your child a second time the outcome for the dog may have been different.