Another fatal dog attack

[LadyGascoyne]

They aren’t going to be keeping the dog alive to determine how dangerous the dog is. The dog has killed a child, it is clearly dangerous and needs to be pts (which it will be).

They will more likely be considering its behavior in the light of whether the humans responsible for it could reasonably have deemed it not a threat to a child, or whether its behaviors indicate that the owner/ carer bears some responsibility for what has happened.

And awful thing, all round. Poor little child.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

As an aside (and going by that Mirror article so let’s say hypothetically rather than confirmed) does anyone know whether there is anything in the legislation or guidance which would prevent an XL bully (assuming registered, neutered etc) being kept with children? Or requiring suitable housing and not something like a tiny flat / house or a static caravan?

I really cant see how it’s sensible to keep anything bigger than a lapdog in such a contained environment, and even a lapdog in a tiny caravan would require significant commitment to exercise.

It does seem like quite a lot of these attacks happen in very suburban areas with small houses and little to no garden. I worry we are setting up the perfect storm with large, powerful dog + small living environment + child or vulnerable adult.

 

[CorvusCorax]

As an aside (and going by that Mirror article so let’s say hypothetically rather than confirmed) does anyone know whether there is anything in the legislation or guidance which would prevent an XL bully (assuming registered, neutered etc) being kept with children? Or requiring suitable housing and not something like a tiny flat / house or a static caravan?

I really cant see how it’s sensible to keep anything bigger than a lapdog in such a contained environment, and even a lapdog in a tiny caravan would require significant commitment to exercise.

It does seem like quite a lot of these attacks happen in very suburban areas with small houses and little to no garden. I worry we are setting up the perfect storm with large, powerful dog + small living environment + child or vulnerable adult.

Some countries do not permit restricted breeds in council/public housing.

 

[maisie06]

I don’t know. Because there are none so blind as those that don’t want to see?
I’m sure not all Labradors carry things in their mouths. I’ve never met one but maybe that’s also nothing to do with genetics.

My springer was quartering at 8 weeks definately genetic he hunts like a demon and it's been there in his DNA since birth so you can't tell me agression isn't genetic

 

[poiuytrewq]

Some countries do not permit restricted breeds in council/public housing.

Whilst that’s a good thing there surely could be a better rule.
Not sure what or how it could be enforced. We lived in a tiny house years ago. It was ours and never had been council but was way too small for a big dog, we didn’t have a dig at all at the time.
Also as someone now, lucky enough to be living in a huge house with loads of land around and space to walk dogs if I wanted never meeting anyone else I (and I’m sure many people here know, I’m not capable of a “proper dog”!!)
There really needs to be some king of thing that states people maybe need some kind of training or whatever to have a difficult breed?

 

[CorvusCorax]

Whilst that’s a good thing there surely could be a better rule.
Not sure what or how it could be enforced. We lived in a tiny house years ago. It was ours and never had been council but was way too small for a big dog, we didn’t have a dig at all at the time.
Also as someone now, lucky enough to be living in a huge house with loads of land around and space to walk dogs if I wanted never meeting anyone else I (and I’m sure many people here know, I’m not capable of a “proper dog”!!)
There really needs to be some king of thing that states people maybe need some kind of training or whatever to have a difficult breed?

And lots of people on the continent have large dogs in apartments with no issue.

 

[maisie06]

As an aside (and going by that Mirror article so let’s say hypothetically rather than confirmed) does anyone know whether there is anything in the legislation or guidance which would prevent an XL bully (assuming registered, neutered etc) being kept with children? Or requiring suitable housing and not something like a tiny flat / house or a static caravan?

I really cant see how it’s sensible to keep anything bigger than a lapdog in such a contained environment, and even a lapdog in a tiny caravan would require significant commitment to exercise.

It does seem like quite a lot of these attacks happen in very suburban areas with small houses and little to no garden. I worry we are setting up the perfect storm with large, powerful dog + small living environment + child or vulnerable adult.

I have spaniels and live in a tiny cottage with a courtyard - BUT I put 110% into suitable excercise and they work during the season and I have no children. I do agree with you that large dogs in unsuitable environments can be a real problem and without sounding like a snob XL bullies seem to be the favoured choice of those who lead chaotic lifestyles living with children in small flats and houses without their physical and mental needs being met - a reciepe for disaster

 

[poiuytrewq]

And lots of people on the continent have large dogs in apartments with no issue.

Oh ok, so what’s the deal there? I’d have imagined lots of people in the UK In apartments have bigger, and actually I don’t mean bigger I mean aggressive types (but In a loose way. I know not all types are types!?)

Is your choice of on the continent rather than just in general for a reason?
Are dog attacks more common in the UK

 

[CorvusCorax]

Oh ok, so what’s the deal there? I’d have imagined lots of people in the UK In apartments have bigger, and actually I don’t mean bigger I mean aggressive types (but In a loose way. I know not all types are types!?)

Is your choice of on the continent rather than just in general for a reason?
Are dog attacks more common in the UK

More people live in apartments on the continent.
As Maisie said, if you put the work in, it's doable. I live in a very small bungalow with two dogs. I've had house guests who haven't even seen them.

 

[poiuytrewq]

More people live in apartments on the continent.
As Maisie said, if you put the work in, it's doable. I live in a very small bungalow with two dogs. I've had house guests who haven't even seen them.

Yes that’s what I meant though in general. Although the place they are kept probably plays a part. It’s surely more the owner and way they are trained than where they are kept.
The best trained dogs I’ve ever seen are kennel kept and I’d say In a space too small, that’s me and my idea of dogs living with me though! But I guess they are worked and occupied and I think this is where the ruled need to lie.

 

[Nasicus]

now im scared

i had to google g00ning the other day

Creasing over here

 

[GSD Woman]

What's that? Just an abbreviation of channel tunnel or??

Yes, channel and tunnel=chunnel

i had to google g00ning the other day

And, I had to look. Learn something new every day. Unfortunately.

And lots of people on the continent have large dogs in apartments with no issue.

I lived in a small apartment with my first GSD and Wire fox terrier. After my first GSD died, I bought "Crazy sable b1tch." Anyway, I put a lot of time into exercising and training. I tried to wear them out in mind and body. And, all exercise had to be on lead or in fenced in areas such as baseball fields.

 

[splashgirl45]

If your dog has been seized by the police you cannot make the pts decision. As has been said by CC.

I realise that , as my post states, I’m saying if it happened to my relative, it would have been daytime and I would have immediately gone to the vets before police arrived, if that was possible . As the owner the decision is mine

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

now im scared

i had to google g00ning the other day

Oh dear, just googled it, I had no idea I can still manage to blush. I can!

 

[I'm Dun]

Oh my sweet summer child

I thought I was the only one who still used that phrase

 

[I'm Dun]

As an aside (and going by that Mirror article so let’s say hypothetically rather than confirmed) does anyone know whether there is anything in the legislation or guidance which would prevent an XL bully (assuming registered, neutered etc) being kept with children? Or requiring suitable housing and not something like a tiny flat / house or a static caravan?

I really cant see how it’s sensible to keep anything bigger than a lapdog in such a contained environment, and even a lapdog in a tiny caravan would require significant commitment to exercise.

It does seem like quite a lot of these attacks happen in very suburban areas with small houses and little to no garden. I worry we are setting up the perfect storm with large, powerful dog + small living environment + child or vulnerable adult.

I've spent the summer living in a static, some of them are fairly big. Mine had 3 bedrooms and me and the 2 whoppets rattled around in it and only used the main areas. I think people get really confused about how much space people and dogs actually need. But of course its easy for me to say that with well exercised dogs that don't tend to move of the bed. The thing that would concern me about a static is how flimsy the doors are, the door wouldn't hold an xl bully if it wanted out.

 

[I'm Dun]

Oh ok, so what’s the deal there? I’d have imagined lots of people in the UK In apartments have bigger, and actually I don’t mean bigger I mean aggressive types (but In a loose way. I know not all types are types!?)

Is your choice of on the continent rather than just in general for a reason?
Are dog attacks more common in the UK

You want to see the dogs that come out of narrow boats sometimes, and narrowboats are 6ftand a half ish wde inside Again though the very nature of narrow boating means tons of exercise and outside time. You cant just chuck your dog outside in the garden all day, you have to walk it and be with it.

 

[MurphysMinder]

As others have said, it is not so much living environment but how the dogs are cared for, exercised etc. I lived for a while in a 2 up 2 down terrace with 4 GSDs, but it did have a large back garden. Dogs had a lot of walking and training as I competed in agility. They were never a problem.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

I've spent the summer living in a static, some of them are fairly big. Mine had 3 bedrooms and me and the 2 whoppets rattled around in it and only used the main areas. I think people get really confused about how much space people and dogs actually need. But of course its easy for me to say that with well exercised dogs that don't tend to move of the bed. The thing that would concern me about a static is how flimsy the doors are, the door wouldn't hold an xl bully if it wanted out.

I suspect you’re also very diligent with walking them and watching their behaviors to be able to intervene if they do get cabin fever.

I think none of us, just by virtue of being interested enough in animal care to be on this site, are probably the average when it comes to dog care.

I think it’s the minority of dog owners of any dog and in any sized property, who put so much effort in. And when the majority of people don’t, and that is compounded by having a big, dangerous dog in a small space then it’s a recipe for disaster.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

I also lived in a very small cottage with 2 collies, 2 JRT's and 4 cats. Only a very small front garden but many miles of beaches, forestry and rural public footpaths, exercise and obedience were key to living peacefully together in small spaces.

 

[CorvusCorax]

I realise that , as my post states, I’m saying if it happened to my relative, it would have been daytime and I would have immediately gone to the vets before police arrived, if that was possible . As the owner the decision is mine

My priority would be getting the relative some medical treatment.

 

[LadyGascoyne]

I don’t really understand why putting down immediately is important.

The issue should be neutralizing the threat (whether that is lethal force at the time, or containing it and putting it down later).

We aren’t talking about putting an animal down as a form of retribution, are we? I understand it to be about removing a threat, so however and whenever it is done seems fine to me. With the caveat, that of course I wouldn’t want any animal enduring months of kenneling with no prospect of a good outcome.

 

[Archangel]

And, I had to look. Learn something new every day. Unfortunately.

Me too, innocently thinking it was something else.

 

[stormox]

Loading…

www.irishmirror.ie

I'm sure this guy is pleased that his dog wasn't immediately put to sleep.

That was over 2 years ago and the man sadly died the following xmas.

 

[CorvusCorax]

That was over 2 years ago and yhe man sadly died the following xmas.

That's tragic, but I am aware of when it was, for those who are not, the date is on the article, and I have already explained the context.

 

[splashgirl45]

My priority would be getting the relative some medical treatment.

I’m not that stupid, if something like that happened I would not be the only adult in the house, her mother and probably my sister would be there . I’m only stating what I would want to do as I wouldn’t want my dog stuck in kennels for months and then PTS with strangers. I’m sure I can’t be the only person on here who would be concerned about that. If I owned a banned breed or a dog with bite history I would expect the police to be involved.

 

[CorvusCorax]

I’m not that stupid, if something like that happened I would not be the only adult in the house, her mother and probably my sister would be there . I’m only stating what I would want to do as I wouldn’t want my dog stuck in kennels for months and then PTS with strangers. I’m sure I can’t be the only person on here who would be concerned about that. If I owned a banned breed or a dog with bite history I would expect the police to be involved.

It doesn't really matter, it's all hypothetical, we all think we know what we would do in a fast-moving and stressful crisis situation, until it actually happens.

 

[Smitty]

I just wish people would open their eyes to the actual breed, size and damage capabilities of the dog they are taking into their home. What it is bred to do would be a starter.

And then, consider what they can offer the dog to compensate for it's breed traits.

And please, if you have a family, however tough or street cred you will look with it, don't get a banned breed.

 

[CorvusCorax]

I just wish people would open their eyes to the actual breed, size and damage capabilities of the dog they are taking into their home. What it is bred to do would be a starter.

And then, consider what they can offer the dog to compensate for it's breed traits.

And please, if you have a family, however tough or street cred you will look with it, don't get a banned breed.

As a generalisation, for some parts of society, it's slightly more complex than that. Involving animals, and indeed humans that are seen as commodities, inability to look at or think about life in the medium to long term, the desirability of a short-term dopamine hit/instant gratification, driven by long-term poverty and lack of opportunity.
I'm repeating myself, but let's also not forget the elephant in the room, IE, how these dogs came about/became popular when other revenue streams were impacted by lockdowns, and the subsequent advertising/glamourisation through social media by the Peaky Blinders cosplayers and their molls.
There are people, of course, who do have more/better capacity for independent thought, but unfortunately a lot of those people seem to fall into the 'deed not breed', 'it's how you raise them', 'if I rescue a dog and shower it in love, it won't tear my leg off' camp.

 

[skinnydipper]

I just wish people would open their eyes to the actual breed, size and damage capabilities of the dog they are taking into their home. What it is bred to do would be a starter.

That's why some people want them - status dogs.