Not sure where I now stand.

[wurzel]

"Tom, why is there a need to chase the stag?

If it is selected to hunt why not shoot it then and there?"

If the harboured stag is where they often are there is no way they can be shot.

It is the topography you see.

Have a look at a map. Get-a-map on the ordnance survey.


Of course there is no actual NEED to chase stags.

But, No chasing = No Stags.

They will all be shot by farmers or poached.

 

[endymion]

Well, I'm glad you admit there is no need to chase a stag.

Why more poachers though?

 

[wurzel]

"You are truly are an un-sung hero.

A wildlife martyr. :smirk:"


Oh no, not a martyr.

I enjoy what i do and I am flourishing.

I enjoy a successful farm plus a tolerable amount of every sort of wildlife. You might find it strange but I have actually taken steps to encourage Water Voles. The Somerset wildlife trust identified an area where there were some trying to get established and I was happy to help.

It is people like you who (not on purpose I am sure) cause more harm than good.

The Red Deer will become extinct because of people like you.

More foxes are dying and struggling in snares because of you.

I am sure you don't mean this to happen but it is reality.

 

[wurzel]

"Well, I'm glad you admit there is no need to chase a stag. "

I don't think you are quite getting the message are you?


There will be more poachers because many potential poachers enjoy stag hunting.

More cold reality for you !!!

Mind if I ask how old you are?

 

[endymion]

I am not surprised at all that you take conservation seriously but there is a huge gulf between conservation and animal welfare. Having enough of everything does mean that they are treated in an ethical matter. This is the basis of the argument.

......and may I remind you that if it wasn't for people like me who live in built up city areas then there wouldnt be a countryside in the first place. What would you do if 5 million Londoners decided they wanted some country air?

 

[endymion]

So let me get this straight people who enjoy stag hunting will poach deer if they can't hunt with hounds? Do you mean poaching with dogs or shooting?

If it's the latter can't they get licenced?

 

[wurzel]

"I am not surprised at all that you take conservation seriously but there is a huge gulf between conservation and animal welfare. Having enough of everything does mean that they are treated in an ethical matter. This is the basis of the argument."

Exactly and this is the gulf between us. To win the argument you would happily scarifice the deer.


" ......and may I remind you that if it wasn't for people like me who live in built up city areas then there wouldnt be a countryside in the first place. What would you do if 5 million Londoners decided they wanted some country air?"

We have too many already thanks. But to answer your question...... emigrate.


You can all have your 1 acre each.

See how many wild red deer there are then !!

 

[endymion]

I don't think there has to be a trade off between welfare and conservation. The Wildlife Trusts have banned hunting on their land for many years now and only shoot occasionally when they are forced too.

You have basically admitted that sometimes there is no need to chase the stag but if you are denied this pleasure then you will shoot more deer out of what? Spite it sounds like to me.

 

[wurzel]

"So let me get this straight people who enjoy stag hunting will poach deer if they can't hunt with hounds? Do you mean poaching with dogs or shooting?"

Some of them yes. And both I expect.


"If it's the latter can't they get licenced?"

By who? And where?

I don't like people out at night on my property with dogs and guns. !!!!

Come on Endy !!!

 

[wurzel]

"I don't think there has to be a trade off between welfare and conservation. The Wildlife Trusts have banned hunting on their land for many years now and only shoot occasionally when they are forced too."

This is irrelevant. I own a business. The deer are a pest.

Work it out.


"You have basically admitted that sometimes there is no need to chase the stag but if you are denied this pleasure then you will shoot more deer out of what? Spite it sounds like to me. "

No spite. They eat my grass.

What is the alternative?

I am not going to go out tomorrow and try and shoot every deer.

But there will be uncontrolled shooting.


To hunt the deer we need to chase them.

 

[endymion]

I presumed you were generalising about Exmoor. Doesn't the Trust issue shooting licences

 

[endymion]

No you dont.

You chase them because you enjoy it.

You can control them by other means.

Anyways, this is getting silly and I have work to do. Time will tell if your predictions come true.

 

[wurzel]

"You chase them because you enjoy it.

You can control them by other means.

Anyways, this is getting silly and I have work to do. Time will tell if your predictions come true."

Yes. I enjoy chasing them.

And yes they can be culled by other means. Just not effectively.

This is silly, i am off to the Lion in Timberscombe.

If my predictions come true it will be very sad. don't you think Endy?

Luckily there are a lot of people round here prepared to break the law. So there is still hope.

 

[endymion]

Yes it will be very sad if a minority of vindictive ex-hunters massacre deer out of vengence. Sad and also pathetic.

Enjoy your drink. Good night.

 

[wurzel]

"Yes it will be very sad if a minority of vindictive ex-hunters massacre deer out of vengence. Sad and also pathetic.

Enjoy your drink. Good night. "

Well I have enjoyed my drink. A real world drink.



I think that you and I recognise that you are being a bit slopey-shouldered !!

Do you understand what that means?

You have demands but the consequenses have nothing do with you !!!

you take no resonsibility yourself do you?


Short of embarrassing me, you have shown what a fake you are.

You are not prepared to say how old you are.

Why not?


You call us pathetic fot shooting deer.

Tell me, what are you doing right now to ensure the deer survive?

The answer is nothing, isnt it?

I have asked you what I should do about the deer.

You have no answer !!!!

This is a real issue..

you are full of accusations. give us some real answers and stop sounding like a fake Endy !!!!!

 

[severnmiles]

I can't help it, it must be my gay side coming out, haha! I'm sure SBB would say so..

Talking of the devil....where is he?

Endy I had a dream (or should that be nightmare?) about NELS the other night...and guess who was the 'ringleader'................................ none other than that annoying little weed from I'm a Celeb Scott Henshall...very random!

 

[severnmiles]

Forget the Itchy and Scratchy show this is the Faggus and Endy show....you two were busy boys last night!

 

[endymion]

Were u pissed last night?

I'm 25.

 

[endymion]

Yeah, a Friday night as well.

Think we need to get a social life and quick. :grin:

 

[Jerome]

Endy, ignore this Fag character. He's simply one of many pros who uses the countryside as a zoo for his private entertainment.

 

[endymion]

I assure you it's water off a ducks back to me.

In fact I rather enjoy getting Tom all worked up, it's turning into a sport in itself, haha!

 

[wurzel]

"Were u pissed last night?"

No more than usual.

I am 50.

 

[wurzel]

"In fact I rather enjoy getting Tom all worked up, it's turning into a sport in itself, haha!"

Oh its a long time since I got all worked up. Probably the Maitresse club in Copenhagen was the last time. Know it? Its on Lygten in Norrebro.

 

[wurzel]

"Endy, ignore this Fag character. He's simply one of many pros who uses the countryside as a zoo for his private entertainment."

Well Jerry, i DO own a chunk of it.

Tell you what. I'll do what pleases me on my property and you do what you want on yours.


I am merely trying to understand why Endy hates the deer so much !!!

 

[endymion]

50? Going a bit senile then, hehe

 

[endymion]

Oh do tell.......

 

[wurzel]

Possibly.

Do you think the Exmoor national park should do anything to save the Exmoor Red deer ?

 

[endymion]

Tom haven't we already had this debate a million times? I think it's time we acknowledged that our opinions are different and we are never going to agree.

Or we can keep going round in circles. I'm never one to back away from a rigorous debate. :grin:

 

[wurzel]

""Tom haven't we already had this debate a million times? I think it's time we acknowledged that our opinions are different and we are never going to agree"


I guess you are right.

I think there should be a viable population of about 2000 Re Deer on Exmoor. The National Park agrees.

You and the LACS want to wipe them out.

Quite perverse !!

Please stay in London.

 

[endymion]

Like I said, time will tell although maybe those that hunt should make up their minds whether their quarry are going to explode in numbers or disappear completely!!