The breeding and selling of banned breeds

[ester]

I do wonder if bullys aren't on the list because as a 'breed' they are pretty new?

I think the legislation generally is a mess, dogs away for extended periods of time then just police dropping the case when challenged and giving them back iseems ridiculous too.

 

[AmyMay]

I'm sorry if you get ones running off lead towards you, you shouldn't have to deal with that. There are greyhounds out there with no prey drive and who're great with all sizes of dogs, but no one wants a giant 40mph dog running towards them!

Thankfully it really doesn’t happen very often. And as most will attest to, I’m generally pretty relaxed about other peoples dogs. But I am ever vigilant x

 

[AmyMay]

Maybe all dogs should have to pass a test where they were fine off a lead with strangers ?

That’s Jack off to the vet then ?

 

[scats]

Well said. My small dogs (Daisy in particular) are always put back on a lead and taken in the opposite direction if I see a greyhound. Not because I consider them a dangerous dog, but because I recognise that my small fluffy white thing could be a huge temptation for a coursing animal. My blood runs cold if I see a loose one running towards me. Same with the two loose male Sharpei’s that were very interested in my dogs yesterday - sadly one breed I’m very, very anxious to meet.

Thank you ?

I met a loose sharpei, in the dark, at my field gate yesterday. Owner was stood about 40 foot away. I shouted that I wanted to get my horses in and could he get his dog, which was semi-barking at my girls (more through fear, I think). Bloke eventually wandered owner and couldn’t get hold of the dog. It looked like it was going to go in my field at one point and my girls were stood just feet away. Man was casually telling me the dog likes to sniff horses legs and will get itself killed one today. Idiot.
Eventually he got hold of it.
Dread to think what would have happened if I hadn’t been around and he’d just remained 40 feet away while his dog harassed my horses.

 

[AmyMay]

Two males on the beach yesterday, owner doing the feeble ‘Timmy, Tommy, here’ call. Me busy putting mine on the lead and trying to ‘casually’ get between them and mine. Them with their hackles up, and me wondering which one of my dogs would get it first ?

It was quite frightening.

The thing is when the owner finally got to me and I’d told him to get his on leads and away from my dogs - he said that ‘yes, they could be a little unpredictable’. Prime example of wrong dogs with wrong owners ???

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Maybe all dogs should have to pass a test where they were fine off a lead with strangers ?

Or maybe owners should just keep their dogs under control?

 

[bonny]

Or maybe owners should just keep their dogs under control?

That’s not my point though, if you can’t let your dogs be loose with strangers then they aren’t safe. There’s two GSDs that live near me that are both only walked after dark and the men with them give everybody a wide berth. I hate to think what would happen if one of them got loose.

 

[FestiveG]

That’s not my point though, if you can’t let your dogs be loose with strangers then they aren’t safe. There’s two GSDs that live near me that are both only walked after dark and the men with them give everybody a wide berth. I hate to think what would happen if one of them got loose.

That makes little sense to me. What do you class as safe with strangers, and where?

 

[Moobli]

That’s not my point though, if you can’t let your dogs be loose with strangers then they aren’t safe. There’s two GSDs that live near me that are both only walked after dark and the men with them give everybody a wide berth. I hate to think what would happen if one of them got loose.

But surely the point is the owners are taking responsibility for their dogs - walking at quiet times and not letting their dogs off lead.
My own GSDs are aloof with strangers but should someone suddenly appear out of the dark from nowhere for example, or run towards me shouting loudly etc etc, they’d likely bark. That’s what I’d want. Mine are companions first and foremost but are also watch dogs and I like the added protection (whether real or imagined) as I live in a remote place.

 

[some show]

I agree, there are loads of dogs who aren't keen on strangers but who, managed with basic common sense, live very happy and fulfilled lives. They don't have to like strangers to be great pets.

 

[AmyMay]

Deleted

 

[bonny]

I agree, there are loads of dogs who aren't keen on strangers but who, managed with basic common sense, live very happy and fulfilled lives. They don't have to like strangers to be great pets.

I’m not saying all dogs have to like strangers but is it asking too much that they don’t attack people if let off lead ?

 

[twiggy2]

Well sure, I didn't know 100% - the majority of staffs weren't KC registered dogs you could track back through the ages - but they tended to be small and squat in stature, not like the taller pitbull. There was one which was brought into the home with a littermate, the staff were told they were staff x bull terrier - one was marked to be PTS by the DEFRA officer, the other wasn't, because one met the measurement criteria and the other didn't. That was how black and white it was.

The measurements are a joke with it but the squat kc type staffies are not how staffies used to be 20 or 30 yrs ago, the pedigree breeding has made them short and bowed legged which is not in the interest of the breed so many of the longer legged types will just be of more old fashioned breeding rather than pits

 

[twiggy2]

That’s not my point though, if you can’t let your dogs be loose with strangers then they aren’t safe. There’s two GSDs that live near me that are both only walked after dark and the men with them give everybody a wide berth. I hate to think what would happen if one of them got loose.

But they are not loose and the owners are being as responsible as possible so I am not seeing what the issue is....

 

[bonny]

But they are not loose and the owners are being as responsible as possible so I am not seeing what the issue is....

Guess we all have different ideas about having a dog, but to me if your dog would attack any dog and possibly person and you are having to avoid everyone while you hang on to a snarling large dog then that’s no life for the dog and I can’t see the point in having one. Plus, there is always a chance, no matter how small that the dog does get loose.

 

[some show]

The measurements are a joke with it but the squat kc type staffies are not how staffies used to be 20 or 30 yrs ago, the pedigree breeding has made them short and bowed legged which is not in the interest of the breed so many of the longer legged types will just be of more old fashioned breeding rather than pits

Totally agree with you!

 

[cbmcts]

It is truly a tragedy what happened to Jack and I really hope that those responsible are held to account. The other hope is that people, in general will start to think about the best way to keep themselves and their children safe around dogs but without the knee jerk demonisation of certain breeds. The last 30-40 years of breed specific legislation worldwide has sadly proven that blaming certain breeds and banning them hasn't reduced deaths or injuries. The real issue as always is people. The general public have to take responsibility for their choices and actions or lack of them and be held to account the first or second time it goes wrong, hopefully long before a fatal attack.

 

[AmyMay]

Guess we all have different ideas about having a dog, but to me if your dog would attack any dog and possibly person and you are having to avoid everyone while you hang on to a snarling large dog then that’s no life for the dog and I can’t see the point in having one. Plus, there is always a chance, no matter how small that the dog does get loose.

Are they ‘hanging on’ ? Or simply walking their dogs at night for some unknown reason?

 

[bonny]

Are they ‘hanging on’ ? Or simply walking their dogs at night for some unknown reason?

They are both seriously scary, everyone round here crosses the road if they see them, there is no way you could just walk past. Acceptable I imagine to lots on here as they are on a lead and kind of under control.

 

[AmyMay]

They are both seriously scary, everyone round here crosses the road if they see them, there is no way you could just walk past. Acceptable I imagine to lots on here as they are on a lead and kind of under control.

They may be scary if you find them ‘scary’. But as above, are they snarling large dogs being hung on to, and are they being walked at night for reasons unknown?

 

[bonny]

They may be scary if you find them ‘scary’. But as above, are they snarling large dogs being hung on to, and are they being walked at night for reasons unknown?

I live in a busy urban area, both owners are going out at night as it’s a lot quieter. I don’t understand your they may be scary if I find them scary comment ?

 

[AmyMay]

I live in a busy urban area, both owners are going out at night as it’s a lot quieter. I don’t understand your they may be scary if I find them scary comment ?

It’s quite simple. To you (for instance) they may be scary, for no other reason other than they’re GS. To Moobli (who owns the breed) they may not be scary. Unless of course they are snarling beasts being hung on to by their owner. In which case many would find them scary.

 

[TheresaW]

Our Bo (collie) has it in him to bite someone. I choose to walk him early and late evening to avoid people for his sake. He’s not a nasty dog at all, a couple of HHOers have met him. His past has however made him very wary, especially of men. He will warn by chattering his teeth if he starts to feel anxious, so I can take him away if we get caught in a situation. He always stays close to me, or OH.

We did get caught out on holiday though. Some pushbikes approached that I knew he wouldn’t like. Had him under control. 30 seconds later, a man came towards us. Generally now 90% of the time, he wouldn’t react, but being wound up by the bikes, he did. Thankfully I had him on the lead, he’s much more relaxed off, and only I ended up slightly injured.

He is 100% other dog neutral.

 

[bonny]

It’s quite simple. To you (for instance) they may be scary, for no other reason other than they’re GS. To Moobli (who owns the breed) they may not be scary. Unless of course they are snarling beasts being hung on to by their owner. In which case many would find them scary.

I’ve already said everyone round here is scared of them, I don’t see what’s so hard to understand about that

 

[windand rain]

My friend had three very large very noisy GSD she text me one night to say her dad was dying and could I go let the dogs out or walk them. I hadn't seen them for months as she had been deeply involved with some guy. I went to the door to be met by the three dogs standing full height at the door snarling and barking. They recognised me and quietened down so I put leads on them by this time it was close to midnight so thought it will be fine they'll look after me. We walked along the track and met some drunks making their way home from the pub the three dogs hid behind me. So much for my protection. I do love GSDs they are wonderful and most have great minds and temperaments I hate terriers and bull breeds I simply don't trust them. I was a postie for many years and was bitten most often by jack russel terriers and collie crosses. Painful bites but fortunately not life threatening but a child might have been different. My baby daughter was scarred for life when a JR bit her face

 

[GSD Woman]

Living in the US I can't really comment on the calling certain breeds dangerous. Pit bulls were not originally bred to be aggressive to humans. It was when the people like the rat buzzard Michael Vick got involved with the breed that things took a swing downwards. Even some of Michael Vick's dog went on to become therapy dogs.
Here pit bull types are banned by certain apartment complexes. The owners can get vets to call them boxer mixes.

However, dog aggressive is part of the breed. Some of the dogs are fine with small animals and other dogs. I wouldn't trust others at all. One of my nieces has a pit bull from a shelter. She is convinced it is all in how you raise them. She is wrong. The dog is under a year right now but give him another 8-12 months and I see him savaging their lab mix.

I did have a pit bull spring up towards my face with the intention of removing it once. Most of the pits I deal with have no such inclination. On average I would rather work with a pit than a Sharpei, Weimaraner, Dalmatian, Chow, Central Asian Shepherd (those are scary dogs), or Akita. Too many dogs of those breeds have been nightmares to work on.

 

[bonny]

Living in the US I can't really comment on the calling certain breeds dangerous. Pit bulls were not originally bred to be aggressive to humans. It was when the people like the rat buzzard Michael Vick got involved with the breed that things took a swing downwards. Even some of Michael Vick's dog went on to become therapy dogs.
Here pit bull types are banned by certain apartment complexes. The owners can get vets to call them boxer mixes.

However, dog aggressive is part of the breed. Some of the dogs are fine with small animals and other dogs. I wouldn't trust others at all. One of my nieces has a pit bull from a shelter. She is convinced it is all in how you raise them. She is wrong. The dog is under a year right now but give him another 8-12 months and I see him savaging their lab mix.

I did have a pit bull spring up towards my face with the intention of removing it once. Most of the pits I deal with have no such inclination. On average I would rather work with a pit than a Sharpei, Weimaraner, Dalmatian, Chow, Central Asian Shepherd (those are scary dogs), or Akita. Too many dogs of those breeds have been nightmares to work on.

I just had a look at fatal dog attacks in the USA, there has been 430 in the last ten years 230 of which were Pitbulls. You seem to have the same problems that we have.

 

[GSD Woman]

bonny, we do have a huge problem with uninformed people and those wanting to be bad a$$e$ with these dogs. They are also very popular. Not all of those dogs are registered APBTs or AKC AM Staffs. So, you never know what you're getting without doing a lot of research. Sort of like my breed.

 

[rowan666]

Because as long as people defend pit bulls and go on about the lovely ones that they know others will keep breeding them. There seems to be a lucrative market for what’s called American Bullie XL, there is plenty of ads on gumtree etc for them, if you’ve got the thousands of pounds to purchase one. There should be no discussion about pit bulls in my opinion, the numbers are increasing, they are getting bigger and it won’t be long before someone else is mauled by one.

American bully and an XL bully are two different breeds and neither are the same as APBT
I have always had large breed dogs (GSD, CC, GD) until my last (EM xDDB) who completely broke my daughters heart when he passed, he was her best friend and protector, weighed in at over 10 stone, terrified people to look at but was honestly the sweetest dog I ever met and you would never find a dog more trustworthy with kids... the tiny terrier I have now would never be trusted in a room alone with kids! Not everyone who owns large breed dogs are chavs who have them as status symbols, some of us just love them for what they are... loyal, protective, loving and beautiful.

How would some of you narrow minded people feel if it was decided to start banning and branding certain breeds of horse dangerous!? Let's PTS all chestnut mares, Arabs, TBs and welsh's because they're crazy and anything over 16.2 because big horses are dangerous... sounds ridiculous doesn't it

 

[bonny]

American bully and an XL bully are two different breeds and neither are the same as APBT
I have always had large breed dogs (GSD, CC, GD) until my last (EM xDDB) who completely broke my daughters heart when he passed, he was her best friend and protector, weighed in at over 10 stone, terrified people to look at but was honestly the sweetest dog I ever met and you would never find a dog more trustworthy with kids... the tiny terrier I have now would never be trusted in a room alone with kids! Not everyone who owns large breed dogs are chavs who have them as status symbols, some of us just love them for what they are... loyal, protective, loving and beautiful.

How would some of you narrow minded people feel if it was decided to start banning and branding certain breeds of horse dangerous!? Let's PTS all chestnut mares, Arabs, TBs and welsh's because they're crazy and anything over 16.2 because big horses are dangerous... sounds ridiculous doesn't it

Horses aren’t in the streets, parks and people’s houses.