would you let a pregnant friend ride your horse?

[SadKen]

When you make decisions for someone else, irrespective of their decision, and based solely on how it will affect you, that's selfish (selfish = (of a person, action, or motive) lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.) I get it, I really do. I'm just not like that, so yes as you say perhaps I am rather odd in that I believe any grown adult can make their own decisions.

But isn't a pregnant woman who is choosing to ride making that decision in her own interests because she wants to ride, and therefore it is equally selfish? Not wrong imho, but there's no denying that the decision to ride by a pregnant woman is exactly the same as a decision not to allow use of a horse by the owner: both are motivated by personal interest and desires.

 

[Spring Feather]

But isn't a pregnant woman who is choosing to ride making that decision in her own interests because she wants to ride, and therefore it is equally selfish? Not wrong imho, but there's no denying that the decision to ride by a pregnant woman is exactly the same as a decision not to allow use of a horse by the owner: both are motivated by personal interest and desires.

Umm I think she's living her life, no? Horse riding is but one part of living that life surely? Perhaps they did have it right in Victorian times; keep the poor silly, incapable woman indoors for 9 months as lifes risks really are too great for her to handle? It's great that feminism has made such great leaps forward ...

 

[SadKen]

Umm I think she's living her life, no? Horse riding is but one part of living that life surely? Perhaps they did have it right in Victorian times; keep the poor silly, incapable woman indoors for 9 months as lifes risks really are too great for her to handle? It's great that feminism has made such great leaps forward ...

I don't think anyone has said anything to that effect at all at any point in this thread, and I certainly wouldn't.

I simply said that a decision to ride is based on personal motivation as much as a decision not to allow a horse to be ridden, so if one is selfish, so is the other. You don't get more egalitarian than that!

 

[fattylumpkin]

No, pregnant women are not children and they should always be free to make any and all decisions regarding their own bodies, just as we the owners are free to make all decisions regarding our horses. I've refused when someone asked to ride my horse because I had safety concerns and that is all this scenario boils down to; concern for the safety of the rider and of the horse. Safety is always a factor when allowing someone else to ride your horse, as is anything that might compromise it, pregnancy or no pregnancy.

 

[FreshandMinty]

interesting viewpoints..

Moomin1, I suspect you would have had a meltdown had you been me a few years back now. I was still riding during my pregnancy (my own horse) and having FW lessons with a very supportive RI who has taught many ladies who are expecting. I booked into a lesson at a clinic with my RI to be told by the YO it was being held at that they didn’t want me riding there while I was pregnant and they wouldn’t give me a slot basically. I do remember at the time being outraged but actually, with the passage of time I can kind of see her point. I did fall off at 6 weeks pregnant (not my horse), baby was fine. I was hellbent on carrying on as normal, actually hated pregnancy and found riding kept me emotionally in a good place and my dr and mw approved too.. if I had my time again Im not sure how I would feel, maybe I would be more accepting of pregnancy and not dislike it as much, however knowing now ,the wonderful child that unborn baby from back then has turned into, Im not sure Id take so many risks

Would I let a pregnant friend ride my horse? If the person was a ‘rider’ then on on my safe, reliable pony yes I would BUT I would definitely have the conversation beforehand about it being at their own risk. If it was a non rider, then most definitely no.

 

[Blurr]

Umm I think she's living her life, no? Horse riding is but one part of living that life surely? Perhaps they did have it right in Victorian times; keep the poor silly, incapable woman indoors for 9 months as lifes risks really are too great for her to handle? It's great that feminism has made such great leaps forward ...

You don't think you're being a tad extremist here? Posters have said "not on my Nelly" not "you're completely incapable and must lie quietly in a darkened room until junior puts in appearance". By all means women should ride during pregnancy (I certainly did) if that is their wish, but not on my horse. I don't want the responsibility or the guilt if something happens. Not that my feeling guilty means that the pregnant friend is incapable of making a rational decision and has no reason to feel guilty themselves should the unthinkable happen. I'm sure any woman would rue the day she set toe in iron (had a drink or a cheap thrill on a roller coaster ) and lost a baby as a result. But on her own horse the guilt is her own and no-one elses.

As for not feeling guilty if a fully functioning pregnant woman of sound mind and body rode your horse and came a cropper, I think you'd have to be a sociopath to feel (or rather, not feel at all) like that. The same if I was giving any friend a lift in my car and was involved in a crash, even if the crash was not my fault I'd feel terrible, if I'd not offered a lift my friend would not be involved Isn't that how people feel when accidents happen?

Given the number who have replied to this thread who have said "no", the very few who have said "it's up to the pregnant friend, not you, you can't make decisions on her behalf based on her pregnancy you patronising anti-feminist" are so far outside the norm as to be an abberation and as such can safely be discounted.

It seems the "neighs" (deliberate sp. error) have it. Love and light peeps, love and light.

 

[Spring Feather]

You don't think you're being a tad extremist here?

Lol! Seriously funny comment! :smile3:

 

[Gloi]

What about when she's had the baby, would you let her ride then. I mean there's always the chance she might fall off and leave the baby without a mother, so whose responsibility would that be then? Women are always getting condemned for doing dangerous things and leaving children behind when they are killed. When can she start riding again? When they are 18?

 

[Spring Feather]

No, pregnant women are not children and they should always be free to make any and all decisions regarding their own bodies, just as we the owners are free to make all decisions regarding our horses. I've refused when someone asked to ride my horse because I had safety concerns and that is all this scenario boils down to; concern for the safety of the rider and of the horse. Safety is always a factor when allowing someone else to ride your horse, as is anything that might compromise it, pregnancy or no pregnancy.

Agree with this totally. And that's my stance on it. Would I let a hapless beginner rider ride my horses? No. Would I let a hapless pregnant beginner rider ride my horses? No. Would I let an experienced rider ride my horses? Yes. Would I let that same experienced rider who has previously been riding my horses, ride while pregnant? Yes. My sole decision is based on whether that person is experienced enough to ride the horse, not because she's pregnant or not pregnant.

I rode right up to around 8 months pregnant; both on my own horses and on other peoples horses who were on full/training livery with me.

 

[Spring Feather]

What about when she's had the baby, would you let her ride then. I mean there's always the chance she might fall off and leave the baby without a mother, so whose responsibility would that be then? Women are always getting condemned for doing dangerous things and leaving children behind when they are killed. When can she start riding again? When they are 18?

Oh don't be so silly. Children are for life, not just for Christmas! :smile3:

 

[DiNozzo]

Isn't it?



Wrong actually. If it were MY horse, it would be completely MY choice.



Of course pregnant women are capable of making rational decisions.
I am 34 weeks pregnant and I'd like to think my mind hasn't turned to mush.

But the point is - no ones saying they CAN'T ride, just that they wouldn't be happy for them to ride THEIR horse.
This is because it brings the horse owner into the decision making/potential for guilt process.

If the woman owned her own horse and decided to ride it, great. I'm not riding personally as my horse was just backed when I got pregnant. But I have lots of friends with suitable horses who HAVE ridden and been absolutely fine. Their horse, their body, their choice.

By giving permission for them to ride your horse, you are enabling them to do a high risk activity which they would not otherwise have been able to access. This is where the feeling of responsibility would come into it for me.

Nothing to do with HER feelings, more to do with my feelings of responsibility for the situation. If she had her own horse, then it would be her choice. If she was asking to ride my horse, then it would be my choice.

I don't see what's so objectionable about this?

Agree completely with this.

MOOMIN1

" It is YOUR choice who to allow riding your horse. It is not YOUR choice what risks that woman takes with HER unborn child. That brings me back to my repeated comments about it being an owner's choice what they do with their horse, but IMO it is superseding a woman's decision to take that risk if you make that decision PURELY because she is pregnant, and not due to her general ability or the horse's temperament coupled with it..."

NOBODY HAS SAID THEY HAD CONTROL OVER A PREGNANT WOMEN'S CHOICES!!! JUST THEY CANNOT TAKE THOSE CHOICES (and indeed chances) WITH THEIR HORSE.

You have already stated who people allow to ride their horse is their own choice, so I don't understand your argument?!

Honestly, I think the risks associated with riding and horses generally are too big for a pregnant women to take. I would not encourage her to continue. If she was working with my horses before her pregnancy I'd ask her to stop because of my feelings on the subject- not because I think pregnant women aren't capable of making their own choices, just that they cannot implement them around my horse.

 

[Patterdale]

Would I let a hapless beginner rider ride my horses? No.

But by your logic, isn't THAT a selfish decision?
If the person has weighed it up in their mind and decided that they want to ride your horse, who are you to tell them that they can't?

I find the comments about feminism deeply offensive. This is nothing to do with women's choice; ALL to do with the horse owner's choice.
Again, has anyone here said that women SHOULDN'T ride, or should be confined to a darkened room? No. Only that they wouldn't want to be responsible in the event of an accident.

 

[Spring Feather]

But by your logic, isn't THAT a selfish decision?
If the person has weighed it up in their mind and decided that they want to ride your horse, who are you to tell them that they can't?

Because I am not putting my horses at risk of being totally ruined by a hapless beginner rider and I don't care whether she's pregnant or not. It's a business decision not an emotional one.

I find the comments about feminism deeply offensive. This is nothing to do with women's choice; ALL to do with the horse owner's choice.

I'm sorry you feel that way, but no matter how it's dressed up, it is not giving the woman her choice. Other people are making that choice for her and absolutely has anti-feminist connotations implied.

Again, has anyone here said that women SHOULDN'T ride, or should be confined to a darkened room? No. Only that they wouldn't want to be responsible in the event of an accident.

Exactly the point I've been making. As I say, I totally get it, you're concerned about how it would personally affect you.

 

[Patterdale]

I'm sorry you feel that way, but no matter how it's dressed up, it is not giving the woman her choice. Other people are making that choice for her and absolutely has anti-feminist connotations implied.

Sorry but I don't agree.
If someone here were saying that they would say no and then do their utmost to stop her riding ANY horse, then yes, I would see your point. But NO ONE has said or even implied that.

The woman is still free to exercise her choice by choosing to go to a riding school or choosing to get her own horse.
And the horse owner is still free to exercise THEIR choice as to who rides their horse.

If I owned a bungee jumping company and a pregnant woman wanted to go bungee jumping, I would say no. YOU might think that this is 'discriminatory' and 'anti-feminist' but I would counter that each person has their own personal level of risk parameters, and we should all respect that.
That means that if the woman feels that bungee jumping is an acceptable risk for her, then I should respect her freedom to make that choice.
But equally, she should respect that its an unacceptable risk for me to watch, and go elsewhere.

 

[Spring Feather]

Sorry but I don't agree.
If someone here were saying that they would say no and then do their utmost to stop her riding ANY horse, then yes, I would see your point. But NO ONE has said or even implied that.

They've said the woman can ride their horse if she's not pregnant. They've said she cannot ride their horse if she is pregnant. Of course they are discriminating. I'm discriminating against crappy riders riding any of my horses.

And the horse owner is still free to exercise THEIR choice as to who rides their horse.

Based on whether the woman is pregnant or not, solely because of how it would make *them* feel should anything happen.

We're never going to agree on this subject matter I fear; opinions are what make the world go round :smile3:

 

[Gloi]

So the moral of the story seems to be 'If you are pregnant and want to ride - keep your mouth shut about it.'

 

[DiNozzo]

So the moral of the story seems to be 'If you are pregnant and want to ride - keep your mouth shut about it.'

Except for the fact that no one has suggested it.

At the very lease me and Patterdale are saying that if a pregnant women wants to ride- its FINE, unless its OUR horse.

 

[Spring Feather]

So the moral of the story seems to be 'If you are pregnant and want to ride - keep your mouth shut about it.'

Yes I think that's about the sum total of it. If you're going to ride other people's horses then the majority of owners *will* discriminate against you, solely because you are pregnant.

Ahh glad we've all finally arrived at the crux of the matter :smile3:

 

[DiNozzo]

Yes I think that's about the sum total of it. If you're going to ride other people's horses then the majority of owners *will* discriminate against you, solely because you are pregnant.

Ahh glad we've all finally arrived at the crux of the matter :smile3:

No, if the arrangement works for the pregnant lady and the owner of the horse that's fine.

We just said we wouldn't be happy with it because of our own risk evaluations and our thresholds of what is and isn't acceptable risk.

I wouldn't look down on or b*ch about anyone because they chose to ride whilst pregnant- they just wouldn't ride my horse!

 

[Ibblebibble]

do riding schools allow pregnant women to ride?

 

[stencilface]

My response stating about FAS was after a poster stated it doesn't cause harm. Hence me saying I was incredulous. Moderate alcohol consumption can cause FAS - where do you draw the line? I for one, would not drink when pregnant.

I don't think moderate alcohol consumption classes as one glass of wine, a bottle would be perhaps. You really need to be dedicated to drinking to cause FAS, not just have the occasional tipple. I didn't drink during the first few weeks of pregnancy as I was on a fitness and health kick. Many, many people drink a lot during the first 6-8 weeks of pregnancy, the highest risk time when they don't know they're pregnant. My SiL was 4 weeks pregnant unknowingly on our ski holiday, she hit it hard, went heli skiing, drinking every day starting at lunchtime etc (you know pretty standard for European skiing!) and there is nothing wrong with my nephew! She stopped drinking that way when she found out, but we did have a nice few glasses of champagne during the course of our pregnancies together

 

[ChesnutsRoasting]

So what I've gleaned from this thread is that many people are selfish. They are making these decisions based on how it will affect *themselves*. Okay, fair enough; not my stance but I guess that's an acceptable viewpoint.

Exactly. Their concern is not primarily about the woman & her unborn child but more to do with their own emotions in the event of an accident and subsequent miscarriage. I would be sad at such a loss but guilty? No. An informed persons choice regardless of the consequences is not my responsibilty but theirs.

 

[ChesnutsRoasting]

do riding schools allow pregnant women to ride?

Mine did. I trusted their judgement, I trusted their horses - the majority of which I'd ridden since I was a child - and they trusted my riding abilty. Hacked out including fast work & jumped.

 

[ChesnutsRoasting]

I don't think moderate alcohol consumption classes as one glass of wine, a bottle would be perhaps. You really need to be dedicated to drinking to cause FAS, not just have the occasional tipple. I didn't drink during the first few weeks of pregnancy as I was on a fitness and health kick. Many, many people drink a lot during the first 6-8 weeks of pregnancy, the highest risk time when they don't know they're pregnant. My SiL was 4 weeks pregnant unknowingly on our ski holiday, she hit it hard, went heli skiing, drinking every day starting at lunchtime etc (you know pretty standard for European skiing!) and there is nothing wrong with my nephew! She stopped drinking that way when she found out, but we did have a nice few glasses of champagne during the course of our pregnancies together

As a once weekly treat whilst pregnant, i would partake, on a Saturday evening after a meal, a small shot of Brandy - it was beautiful.

 

[Spring Feather]

do riding schools allow pregnant women to ride?

I expect it's the same as with trekking/trail riding places, they all have their own rules, so some will allow it, others not.

When I was pregnant we travelled a fair bit that year and I rode, not at riding schools, but trail riding/trekking places (in France, England, Spain, USA) multiple times that year and none of them had any problem with me riding. They weren't slow rides, they were fast rides galloping through the forests and over the moorland. I guess the places I went to had no problem with it, but I do understand other places not allowing it. As we've seen on here, people have different (and strong!) opinions on the subject.

 

[BSL]

Haven't read all replies, but my simple answer is no, but then I don't let anyone else ride my horse.

 

[kassieg]

I would 100% trust my horse with anyone ! a 3 year old child, pregnant lady or a granny she is an angel but it is up to them if they want to risk it

 

[kez81]

Yes I would Let a pregnant woman ride just same as I would let a child ride or a disabled person ride or a total novice or top class eventer. I would however in all instances have any person riding my horse sign a disclaimer to say they understand riding to be a dangerous sport and accept that they ride or handle any of my horses entirely at their own risk.

 

[Fides]

I don't think moderate alcohol consumption classes as one glass of wine, a bottle would be perhaps. You really need to be dedicated to drinking to cause FAS, not just have the occasional tipple.

I didn't say that it did - as I said in my previous post, my post was aimed at the person that said alcohol causes no harm. FWIW though FAS has been seen in women who drank 2-3 units a day (classed as moderate) - IQs of 60-80 are not infrequent, even if there are no physiological health issues normally associated with the condition. It is VERY easy to spot a baby/child/person with FAS as the facial features are quite obvious.

 

[Moomin1]

I didn't say that it did - as I said in my previous post, my post was aimed at the person that said alcohol causes no harm. FWIW though FAS has been seen in women who drank 2-3 units a day (classed as moderate) - IQs of 60-80 are not infrequent, even if there are no physiological health issues normally associated with the condition. It is VERY easy to spot a baby/child/person with FAS as the facial features are quite obvious.

I would have thought 2-3 units per day is more than moderate, but may be wrong.